Rejection Sensitivity

[Bostontraitor]

I’ve been rejected plenty of times. honestly, I could call myself an expert at it. My advice to leads who feel uncomfortable with rejection is simple: move on and focus on becoming a better dancer. There will always be another girl who’s happy to dance with you, and hopefully you’ll be able to give her a great experience.
There are many reasons a follower might say no:
Some are temporary. For example: 1. You’re too sweaty, and she doesn’t want to risk having to change after the dance. 2. She’s genuinely tired and just needs a break. In that case, you’ll probably have another chance later that same night.
Other reasons? You already know them. And honestly, they don’t matter. Just move on. it’s not worth wasting your energy when there are plenty of dancers who will say yes to you. Remember, a “pity dance” always worse than a polite “No, thank you.” I had many of those too.


Don’t we all get rejected in other parts of life too, like dating or jobs? Or am I the only lucky one?

 

[Offbeat]

In our small community, it's the opposite. The regulars pick out people they know and are comfortable with. There isn't a high level bias but there is definitely a friends' bias (or bias towards people who are frequently seen at parties and are known quantities)

This is common everywhere. People feel comfortable asking and dancing with those they know.

 

[azana]

Remember, a “pity dance” always worse than a polite “No, thank you.” I had many of those too.

Absolutely. Something I’ve always felt strongly. Especially if they ask you when a song is past halfway through to tick off that ‘owed’ dance, or make it clear during a dance it’s not voluntary on their part and they want to be there. I would much prefer they didn’t bother proffering a dance in the first place.

Yes, I sense my cynicism growing in my older age …

I find it can be easier to ask those you don’t know, particularly in different scenes when I’m travelling. They don’t know or haven’t worked out yet whether you’re in the ‘cool’ crowd or not . At the same time, you get those sweet moments with the leads who know you, such as the guy who came and grabbed me last time I went dancing when Ojos Chinos came on, aware that it’s a favorite of mine

 

[MamboCha]

Absolutely. Something I’ve always felt strongly. Especially if they ask you when a song is past halfway through to tick off that ‘owed’ dance, or make it clear during a dance it’s not voluntary on their part and they want to be there. I would much prefer they didn’t bother proffering a dance in the first place.

As a lead I rarely ask once the song is way passed the start, as it could be seen for this reason, unless she is next to me and already grooving. But this kind of mind is not where the body is pity dance is torture indeed, and would have much preferred a straight no thanks. Worst is momentary hesitation before extending the hand, instant bad vibe from previous experiences, yet unable to disengage. Luckily this only happens rarely, so nothing lingers.

 

[Chris_Yannick]

I will ask when the song is half over but that will almost always result in dancing the next song too.

Asking someone to dance halfway through a song without asking for the next song would definitely feel off.

 

[Smejmoon]

when I was a noob, I did half dances a lot. didn't have a confidence for entire song, if I didn't know it and/or the partner.

 

[Offbeat]

As a lead I rarely ask once the song is way passed the start, as it could be seen for this reason,

I definitely dont ask after the song is past 25%. Unless it is a friend, you never know how the follower will react. They might think you think she is not worthy of full song. It is a tricky situation. If it is a friend or she is grooving like you said then it is very different situation. Though I always prefer to ask within first 30 seconds to 45 seconds. That makes about 95% of my ask.

unlesslWorst is momentary hesitation before extending the hand, instant bad vibe from previous experiences, yet unable to disengage. Luckily this only happens rarely, so nothing lingers.

Momentary hesitation is not uncommon. But my experience has been more positive. Very rare that momentary hesitation results in a bad dance. That can also be said of enthusiastic yes, which results in bad dance.

In almost all cases how the yes was said is not correlated to how the dance turns out. I adjust my dancing to follower’s style. So unless she is very wild and uncontrollable, or really drunk who can’t hold her balance; I can work with a partner. Yeah sometimes after 4 minute mark with some partners, I am like when will the song end. I start getting bored. But that is not dancing out of pity. There are also partners with whom I have enjoyed dancing 20 minutes to live music.

 

[Offbeat]

I will ask when the song is half over but that will almost always result in dancing the next song too.

Asking someone to dance halfway through a song without asking for the next song would definitely feel off.

Yeah. And is she says no to the next song ?

 

[Bostontraitor]

Absolutely. Something I’ve always felt strongly. Especially if they ask you when a song is past halfway through to tick off that ‘owed’ dance,

Oh wow, that’s interesting. I never really thought about how that kind of thing might put a little pressure on the person you ask for the next dance.


For me, I usually don’t ask anyone once the song’s past the one-minute mark, unless it’s a close friend or someone I dance with all the time. That way, I’m almost guaranteed the next song with them. If you ask someone new that late, it can easily feel like: oh you couldn't find a follower in time, so I am your backup?

 

[Chris_Yannick]

Yeah. And is she says no to the next song ?

Can't remember it ever happening!

What I like about asking halfway into a song is precisely that I can spend more time dancing with someone. In my world, one song typically isn't enough to feel out a person's style.

 

[eclo]

Isn't this basically a sign of a not so great dancer? Unable to dance of out the bubble where everyone knows everyone's style. I'm not criticizing, I've done this too - purely out of necessity, rather than deliberate choice. Same for my mates I assume, we wouldn't get many dances out of our bubble.

Aside from shyness etc issues, IMHO yes it is.
I also think it's more specifically it's a sign of not so great dancers who have an inflated opinion of their own dancing (whether they're truly conscious of this or not).
They can look super advanced dancing with someone on their performance team or from the same scene, but step outside the comfort zone and a lot of weaknesses will come out. I think this explains a lot of the cliques, it seems snobby to the outside but a lot I think is insecurity.

But imho if you don't step out of that comfort zone you will pretty much be on a permanent plateau.

 

[MamboJazz]

What I like about asking halfway into a song is precisely that I can spend more time dancing with someone. In my world, one song typically isn't enough to feel out a person's style.

I remember years ago I read this here from someone who used this a his tactics to get more dance time with someone specific. It took me long time to understand what he was talking about, because here in Germany asking unknowns for a second dance is normal, if the first dance was good enough. I had to learn it's a complete no-go elsewhere. Already in Switzerland second dance always was rejected, the same on EU festivals - without any exception as far as I remember. I will never fully understand it. So recently at Stuttgart festival it was nice to have lots of second dances with german girls, and I never got rejected asking for it. Seems asking for a second dance in other countries is regarded as being intrusive. For the german mind it's efficient I guess: when the first dance was good your probability for the next dance being good as well is way higher if you stay with the same person. But ok, I get it, cultures are different.

I don't like asking halfway into a song because every song has a structure, and if I didn't dance the first half to it I will have more problems to understand this structure and will fail more with guessing accents.

 

[MamboCha]

I remember years ago I read this here from someone who used this a his tactics to get more dance time with someone specific. It took me long time to understand what he was talking about, because here in Germany asking unknowns for a second dance is normal, if the first dance was good enough. I had to learn it's a complete no-go elsewhere. Already in Switzerland second dance always was rejected, the same on EU festivals - without any exception as far as I remember. I will never fully understand it. So recently at Stuttgart festival it was nice to have lots of second dances with german girls, and I never got rejected asking for it. Seems asking for a second dance in other countries is regarded as being intrusive. For the german mind it's efficient I guess: when the first dance was good your probability for the next dance being good as well is way higher if you stay with the same person. But ok, I get it, cultures are different.

I don't like asking halfway into a song because every song has a structure, and if I didn't dance the first half to it I will have more problems to understand this structure and will fail more with guessing accents.

Thanks for insights. Handy when making my rounds there...

 

[MamboCha]

Aside from shyness etc issues, IMHO yes it is.
I also think it's more specifically it's a sign of not so great dancers who have an inflated opinion of their own dancing (whether they're truly conscious of this or not).
They can look super advanced dancing with someone on their performance team or from the same scene, but step outside the comfort zone and a lot of weaknesses will come out. I think this explains a lot of the cliques, it seems snobby to the outside but a lot I think is insecurity.

But imho if you don't step out of that comfort zone you will pretty much be on a permanent plateau.

Second that. Many of those may look good in their little circles, but in social dancing very lacking, even some performance team members ...

So tip for learners: if you're a lead go out of your way to dance with those you don't know and spend the first 5,10 seconds doing the basics and trying to get a feel of where the follower is, like higher, lower, same as you; and for follow set yourself a time limit, say 5min, no dance then pick a lead you like and go ask.

 

[Chris_Yannick]

Yeah sometimes after 4 minute mark with some partners, I am like when will the song end. I start getting bored. But that is not dancing out of pity.

Imo, if you didn't make yourself visibly bored, then it isn't a pity dance.

There's this person in my scene who I do not particularly enjoy dancing with (forever beginner, stiff, strong perfume scent). I will never ask her for a dance but she will ask me. I won't say no. I'll even dance 2 songs with her in a row. Obviously she likes dancing with me but in my mind I'm secretly hoping the song will end sooner than later. I do not classify this as a pity dance though especially if the other person doesn't feel it.

There's another person I dislike dancing with because she's very rough but again I don't make it visible that it's the worst dance of the night for me.

In both cases, I know they like dancing with me but the feeling isn't mutual. I don't classify them as pity dances though.

 

[sunsoul]

I used to be fairly set in my ways and just danced once with everyone. Now, if I dance with someone I know or we just had a good dance then I ask for a second dance no problem. Going with my above assertion to maximise the good times..

 

[Chris_Yannick]

because here in Germany asking unknowns for a second dance is normal,

It's normal here too. It is ingrained in the culture to keep dancing multiple times with the same person and it was a shock for me in the beginning coming from a one dance scene.

That's why half dances aren't seen as anything other than a warm up as they don't count as full dances and it's normal to dance one more.

 

[MamboCha]

It's normal here too. It is ingrained in the culture to keep dancing multiple times with the same person and it was a shock for me in the beginning coming from a one dance scene.

That's why half dances aren't seen as anything other than a warm up as they don't count as full dances and it's normal to dance one more.

May I ask where are you? Good to know where seconds are norms...

 

[Chris_Yannick]

May I ask where are you? Good to know where seconds are norms...

Slovakia. If coming from the U.S., you can throw out everything you know about dance etiquette out the window. Even among other European nations, Slovakia is an enigma in the social dancing community. Extremely friendly local community and if you have any basic dance knowledge at all, you’ll never be in short supply for dances. Level is low and there isn’t much Mambo or ChaChaCha (I know everyone who can dance it well in the entire country), but if you’re into parties with casual vibe or sensual dancing (+if you like drinking), it’s a dance haven. Been here 10 years and while I’ve grown out of the scene (due to the changing dance landscape that doesn’t cater to my snobby On2 tastes), it’s still an experience many foreigners can enjoy if they can get out of their own heads.

 

[MamboCha]

Slovakia. If coming from the U.S., you can throw out everything you know about dance etiquette out the window. Even among other European nations, Slovakia is an enigma in the social dancing community. Extremely friendly local community and if you have any basic dance knowledge at all, you’ll never be in short supply for dances. Level is low and there isn’t much Mambo or ChaChaCha (I know everyone who can dance it well in the entire country), but if you’re into parties with casual vibe or sensual dancing (+if you like drinking), it’s a dance haven. Been here 10 years and while I’ve grown out of the scene (due to the changing dance landscape that doesn’t cater to my snobby On2 tastes), it’s still an experience many foreigners can enjoy if they can get out of their own heads.

Sold! Yes I'm in NYC on2 but dance plenty on1 with out of towners. In fact my standing joke when asked is one and a half! That pretty much earned instant puzzle then chuckle from follows