Is Kizomba just dry humping?

[Smejmoon]

Why not just ban Kizomba threads altogether?

People might mention it or BS or other forms of dry humping by accident or typo and banning seems too harsh.

More reasonable would be for each mention of k-word to decrease a font size by one point for a month. Each mention, and text gets a bit smaller. Once lesson is learned it will grow back again.

 

[AguaDulce]

It certainly looks that way to me!

Please discuss.

This should dispel the notion, once and for all, that Kizomba is not Dry Humping

 

[Bostontraitor]

This should dispel the notion, once and for all, that Kizomba is not Dry Humping

I hope they have enough chlorine for the cleaning after this.

 

[Offbeat]

This should dispel the notion, once and for all, that Kizomba is not Dry Humping

If you turn off the music and look at the pool you think something is odd. While some people are doing what people usually do in the pool, the others appear to be hugging without moving (like statues)

Made me laugh

 

[Sabrosura]

I'll just leave these videos here:

Me dancing urban kiz at the outdoor dancing location where we dance kizomba almost every day in Paris during the summer, with a really good lead with super smooth and musical weight transfers

(Usually this place is full, anywhere from 100 to 200 people, and the dancing is completely free and organized by the DJs in the community; but that evening was rainy so it was just a few people).

(Two separate videos)

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music you love, upload original content, and share it all with friends, family, and the world on YouTube.

youtube.com

 

[AKon1]

Your typical urban kiz studio

I really think urban kiz just started as a bet between a dancer and a dj in Paris. 'I can take the shittiest music you can give me and make a dance craze with it!' Kind of like how scientology started as a bet that L. Ron Hubbard couldn't create a religion.

 

[Yogalholic]

I've just watched an interview of a French Kizomba DJ. He said that Salsa organizers started to include Kizomba in Salsa parties, it's not Kizomba people who crashed in Salsa events (at least in Paris)

 

[Offbeat]

I've just watched an interview of a French Kizomba DJ. He said that Salsa organizers started to include Kizomba in Salsa parties, it's not Kizomba people who crashed in Salsa events (at least in Paris)

Why did salsa organizers started to include Kizomba but not Tango or WCS or Fusion? That tells you something. I wouldn’t go by one DJ’s word.

From what I seen in the USA - salsa instructors started promoting bachata and the Kizomba instructors started poaching on the salsa scene. That’s how you got to SBK. Why do Kizomba people attend SBKs? May be the scene is bifurcating now but the history of the past 15 years is otherwise.

 

[AKon1]

Why did salsa organizers started to include Kizomba but not Tango or WCS or Fusion? That tells you something. I wouldn’t go by one DJ’s word.

From what I seen in the USA - salsa instructors started promoting bachata and the Kizomba instructors started poaching on the salsa scene. That’s how you got to SBK. Why do Kizomba people attend SBKs? May be the scene is bifurcating now but the history of the past 15 years is otherwise.

I noticed this year LA there was one Kiz workshop on the last hour of the last day and there was no Kiz social floor. The year prior a lot of people had complained that the Bachata DJ keep playing Kiz. Hopefully the scene is bifurcating.

I also noticed that the Zook dancers have taken over the Kiz floor at a few congresses like Hawaii.

 

[Winston]

I have the great suspicion that it were the salsa dance teachers who start offering kizomba lessons. Teachers of small communities, or in large cities saturated with teachers (dance studios).

Salsa students stop after a certain time if they have plateaued, so in order to keep the revenue stream flowing teachers will offer other dances to their pool of existing students.
And they first look at the simple to learn dances, at least the basics must be straightforward.
Then they ask the dj's and promotors to play that new style in order to make it viable for students to keep following their new dance course. And also the students will ask the dj to be able to explore and enjoy what they've learned. And boom: you have the new hot dance craze. Untill you have SBK now.

Tango is more difficult to learn than kiz. WCS, fusion and Hustle music sounds western, maybe they want african/caribbean music for a better fit with salsa. Are there social dancing combi parties for those styles?

And I see a trend with regard to kompa. I hope it won't grow as big as kizomba. And if it grows, that they won't combine it with salsa.

 

[Offbeat]

I noticed this year LA there was one Kiz workshop on the last hour of the last day and there was no Kiz social floor. The year prior a lot of people had complained that the Bachata DJ keep playing Kiz. Hopefully the scene is bifurcating.

I also noticed that the Zook dancers have taken over the Kiz floor at a few congresses like Hawaii.

At SFSBK the zouk floor at 100 to 150 dancers. Kizomba had only 20 or 25. 10 years ago it used to the other way round.

It is driven by who is driving and growing the community locally. Enthusiastic and active instructors can quickly grow the community within a year or two. Once they move out to another city, if there is no one to step in, the scene starts losing its steam. That is what happened with Kizomba after 5-6 years. It was big enough to host two Kizomba festivals a year for a few years. Zouk never grew much until some years back. Then a young couple instructor moved into the area. They grew the zouk community ever since.

Since these scenes are not that big compared to salsa and bachata, the local dynamics play a big role.

 

[Offbeat]

I have the great suspicion that it were the salsa dance teachers who start offering kizomba lessons. Teachers of small communities, or in large cities saturated with teachers (dance studios).

In my experience at least the salsa instructors crossed over to teach bachata and made it popular. The influencers and instructors that grew Kizomba and zouk didn’t come from salsa. May be later some salsa instructors might have jumped on the bandwagon in their local communities. The main influencers for the spread of either were certainly not salsa instructors. Salsa instructors may have helped the kizomba or zouk promote classes.

Neither kiz nor zouk music can be called Latin.

 

[MamboJazz]

In my experience at least the salsa instructors crossed over to teach bachata and made it popular. The influencers and instructors that grew Kizomba and zouk didn’t come from salsa. May be later some salsa instructors might have jumped on the bandwagon in their local communities. The main influencers for the spread of either were certainly not salsa instructors. Salsa instructors may have helped the kizomba or zouk promote classes.

There were africans living in europe who started salsa dancing because it was closer to their preferences than western music. Some africans became salsa instructors and/or salsa DJs. In my area there was an angolan who told us at a workshop that as a salsa DJ he had tried for more than 10 years to play one kizomba song here and there, but people never liked it. And then suddenly, in 2012, it made boum! and kizomba exploded. He himself couldn't understand why. But no one can predict crazes - music companies would pay high salaries to someone who could predict crazes but it never was really possible, there remains always some mystery.

Few years later when urban kizz took over the kizomba scene many portuguese africans started complaining that this had nothing to do with their dance. Best hateful ranting website from an angolan that I know is this one where he rants about the french africans who committed fraud and lies. Nice read (choose "english" from the Google Translate Button):

Kizomba - Kizomba Homepage

Kizomba Informationsseite. Tanz, Entstehung, Anleitungen uvm.

www.kizomba-classic.de

 

[Winston]

@Offbeat
I agree that kiz and zouk are not latin. Although original zouk music came from the french caribbean. But caribbean is not real latin. Beside zouk, the caribbean has calypso and soca. But also salsa and bachata.
After the lambada music bands stopped, the lambada instructors and dancers started to use french zouk first. And adjusted the lambada to zouk music, and zouk dance was born. And later they also took music from parts of africa to dance (eq. ghetto zouk).

Zouk had it's own scene in Brazil. And than the travelling instructors (influencers) brought it world wide. And the local teachers took over, including the salsa teachers. But of course also new specialized zouk teachers.

But in order to invade the salsa parties, the salsa instructors played a bigger role I suspect, although maybe not in your scene.

I think every dance style has/had it's own scene, including all bachata (sub styles), no matter how small or localized. But to infect parties in other dance scenes, there must be a vector. A carrier that will transmit the dance. And dance instructors are the best suited for that.

Another thing to establish a dance craze is if there is enough good contemporary music for that dance style.
But than again, it's the teacher that are keeping an eye on the music releases in a certain time period.

 

[Offbeat]

There were africans living in europe who started salsa dancing because it was closer to their preferences than western music. Some africans became salsa instructors and/or salsa DJs. In my area there was an angolan who told us at a workshop that as a salsa DJ he had tried for more than 10 years to play one kizomba song here and there, but people never liked it. And then suddenly, in 2012, it made boum! and kizomba exploded. He himself couldn't understand why. But no one can predict crazes - music companies would pay high salaries to someone who could predict crazes but it never was really possible, there remains always some mystery.

Few years later when urban kizz took over the kizomba scene many portuguese africans started complaining that this had nothing to do with their dance. Best hateful ranting website from an angolan that I know is this one where he rants about the french africans who committed fraud and lies. Nice read (choose "english" from the Google Translate Button):

Kizomba - Kizomba Homepage

Kizomba Informationsseite. Tanz, Entstehung, Anleitungen uvm.

www.kizomba-classic.de

Yes urban kizz took the Kizomba in a different direction. The original or “traditional” Kizomba was also a European product made by Angolans in Europe and lusophone region.

 

[AKon1]

At SFSBK the zouk floor at 100 to 150 dancers. Kizomba had only 20 or 25. 10 years ago it used to the other way round.

It is driven by who is driving and growing the community locally. Enthusiastic and active instructors can quickly grow the community within a year or two. Once they move out to another city, if there is no one to step in, the scene starts losing its steam. That is what happened with Kizomba after 5-6 years. It was big enough to host two Kizomba festivals a year for a few years. Zouk never grew much until some years back. Then a young couple instructor moved into the area. They grew the zouk community ever since.

Since these scenes are not that big compared to salsa and bachata, the local dynamics play a big role.

My working theory is that Kiz will kill itself because on the lead side it appeals to creeps and grifters. Thats not to say all Kiz leads/instructors are creeps and grifters but an unusually high percentage of them are. Just like not all salseras are divas but there are way more divas on the salsa floor relative to other Latin dances.

From the leads prospective its an extremely low skill low athleticism dance. There is no true basic, its just step on which ever beat you want so the lead is always right. Its a low BPM (why DJs hate it) so you don't need to have athleticism to keep up, the music is also complete and utter trash. And its danced extreamly close is a 2fer because close closed hides a lack of ability and gets you to feel up the girl. If you just started dancing because you heard "instructors get laid a lot" then kiz is the dance for you because you don't need any actual talent, skill, or hard work. The work is all on the follow.

Zook on the other hand while being the exact same beat is extremely hard. Zook has a basic. The beat is the same but the music is far more complex and you are expected to dance to both the beat and the melody. It can range from low BPM to very high BPM. So you cant hide a lack or athleticism. I'm glad to see Zook handing Kiz its lunch. As I've learned from this forum and other DJs they hate Kiz. Low BPM trash music brings the energy of the entire social down. Our DJs will play zook instead and it makes the kiz instructors mad because they cant move that fast.

 

[AKon1]

Like bachata, salsa and everything else, Kizomba is primarily split into those who like Urban Kizomba and those that like the 'traditional' Kizomba. Most leads who dance regularly I think prefer to dance the urban.

Because its easy!

 

[DJ Yuca]

@Offbeat
But caribbean is not real latin.

What?

 

[DJ Yuca]

In the UK it was salsa promoters and instructors who embraced kizomba with open arms. The obvious hope was that it would be like salsa had been until recently i.e. fashionable and popular.

 

[Sabrosura]

Because its easy!

LMAO Thanks for the laughs!!!

Anyone who dances even a tiny bit of kizomba will figure out pretty quickly that regular kizomba (danced in close position, with saidas etc.) is fairly easy (though there is still much more technique involved than in bachata, for example), whereas urban kiz is a *beast* to learn, for both leads and follows. This is because there is an infinite variation of moves and you must be able to lead and follow across multiple lines of dance and from multiple lead / follow angles.

I've been dancing salsa for many years and I consider urban kiz much more difficult to lead and follow than salsa.

Even in France, which is the home of urban kiz, the number of leads and follows who are skilled at urban kiz is much much lower than those who dance regular kizomba.