Salsa open diary

Offbeat said:
I was maintaining open embrace and she kept trying to come close knocking her knees against my legs.
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Well, maintaining connection at the thighs is part of the follow's job (as well as the lead's) to achieve proper lead-follow connection, so that, in and of itself, is a good thing that she was trying to do that. Traditional kizomba is danced in closed position with thigh connection. Urban kiz is danced open position but then it will be obvious that the urban steps are happening (and I take it that's not what you were trying to do).

Of course, if you were knocking knees then something was off with one or both people's positioning. It sounds like she might have been thinking kizomba = sensual bachata. Noooooo :p
 
I noticed right now in the video that I don't move my spine enough. Especially during solo, when there are less excuses for static postures. Salsa just got much harder.
 
I was finally able to get out dancing for the first time in about a year and eight months (partly pandemic/lockdown-related, partly heavy workload). I expected to be nervous, but no, I was simply hugely excited. I was going to enjoy it, no matter what. I think I smiled and laughed the whole night, and that did seem to help in getting dances, too. Instead of the long break being a concern, it actually turned out to be a very handy excuse if I missed a lead or lost my timing (I'm now wondering how long I can milk that excuse :) ). Remembering how to dance turned out not to be a problem. The fact that three leads came back later for second dances tells me I was doing okay and signalled success! Thank you, lovely leads :)

The band was a good one, save for the sudden frantic drum solos. Leads and follows would look at each other as if to say "What do we do with this? Okay, yeah, let's just shine. Um, how do we keep shining to this furious drumming...?' Good sized crowd.

I would like to thank the first guy I approached, who readily danced with me, smiled, blamed himself for any slip ups, and came back later for a second. You obliterated all of my nerves and nervous excitement. You are gorgeous (literally, actually, loved those arms hehe :) ) . I would like to thank the second guy I danced with. I had been about to ask him when he suddenly moved off (hadn't seen me; but it made me look a bit ridiculous). What do you know - he came and asked me next song. Superb dancer, brushed off my concerns about my timing, introduced himself. You are lovely. And I would like to thank the next guy, who I had danced with quite a bit in the past, for giving me a few dances, remembering exactly what I like (sorry, you purists, but I'm not apologising that it's spinning and multi-spinning among other things!, Forums anathema :) ), and the lovely compliment. You really restored my confidence.

I kept smiling through the beginner lets-mostly-basic-the-whole-song, I'll squash your finger, then I'll come and sit and talk to you about Adelaide, Adelaide football teams and American gridiron (very nice person, actually, did his very kind best to show interest in interesting sports like baseball and ice hockey to humor me :) ) I kept smiling through the weird timing guy and our two dances. It was on5, then, no, it is on1, then no, you're back on5 and doing Cuban spaghetti and no, I've got it! You're dancing on2! Yes! Hey, no, it's definitely on1 ... okay give up...

I had forgotten what a huge high a good night out of salsa provides :)
 
I have an confession. I have a bachata dance friend who usually dance bachata with me. She's a good follower. The other day I asked her for a salsa song, which I had done that a few times in the past with her. Noted that she's not a trained salsa dancer. The salsa song has a fast pace and very energetic. I had stopped a few times just to let her to catch up, but towards the end, the music got into my head, that I completely forgot to pay attention to her. She had to stop the dance and told me to end the dance. She explained that she's not a salsa dancer and she couldn't keep up with my energy when I spinned as much as I expected from her. Fortunately that she's a friend, that she told me that we are still good. Even though she accpeted my apology, I had a rude awakening that how terrible a dancer I am.
 
Had the privilege to see the Legend Dom Um Romero in the Jazz cafe in London in the mid 1990s a long time ago now ,what a night ! something i still remember when i saw him for the first time amazing
I still love the Album Hotmosphere recored on Pablo record label some of the best brazilian melodies
Escravos de jo
pra que chorar
 
Recently I've caught myself to the thought that with several people, if they dance really close to me and match everything, I can't tell who is it unless I open eyes. I forget. Especially with kizomba oriented ladies.
Their personality somehow dissolves and they just flow around me in their waves.

Or might be an old age and start of memory problems from too much coca cola.

On the other hand salsa oriented dancers are very distinct, I've had nights in last weeks, where each dance is a special story, with different colors and dynamics than others.

I'm going out 4 nights a week like 10 years ago. Half of it is hardcore salsa, half of it is salsa mixed with some bachata and kizz. Or salsa with bs and kizz dancers.
 
Smejmoon said:
Recently I've caught myself to the thought that with several people, if they dance really close to me and match everything, I can't tell who is it unless I open eyes. I forget. Especially with kizomba oriented ladies.
Their personality somehow dissolves and they just flow around me in their waves.
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Oh yes, that's what I call the "trance" mode in kizomba dancing, it's a wonderful and magical experience :)
I actually had this conversation with a female kiz friend a few days ago, that when we're dancing a long, super-connected kiz session in "douceur" mode (full hug, eyes closed, the lady's head on the guy's chest almost the entire time) all sense of time and space and who the person is and who we are seems to disappear, except for the shared connection, and we actually forget what the guy looks like/who he is (unless it's a close friend of course). It feels like a different dimension of existence where you and your partner just "are" and everything else except for the music and connection falls away. I never experienced this in dancing before I started dancing kiz.
 
I will never close my eyes when dancing Salsa for logistical reasons. But I have noticed when followers feel safe enough to close their eyes when dancing with me. Had my fair share of those dances during the marathon with different partners. I enjoyed leading them and it added an extra dimension to the dance.
 
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Kizomba dancers dance in close position. So it's safe for a lady to close her eyes. I wouldn't try that with salsa, it's important to see what's coming especially for the hand tricks. When I started kizomba, I was taught to lead with my chest, and the steps are simple. A good follower doesn't need eyes to see because the lead doesn't let her out of his control. kizomba's rhythm is also simple, you basically dance to the beats. Of course I didn't consider those fancy urban-kiz moves.

It's a completely different dance experience than salsa. While all of your guys laugh at kizomba and sensual bachata, those dances have their merits. Dancers enjoy them as much as salsa dancers. I have a friend she who started dancing bachata together with me. Now she only dances kizomba.
 
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Chris_Yannick said:
I will never close my eyes when dancing Salsa for logistical reasons. But I have noticed when followers feel safe enough to close their eyes when dancing with me. Had my fair share of those dances during the marathon with different partners. I enjoyed leading them and it added an extra dimension to the dance.
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Interesting, I don't think I've ever closed my eyes in salsa (for more than a second) because any closed position dancing is very short, so no opportunity to close eyes.

I also am always mindful of the people dancing around me in salsa as it's very easy for a follow's "styling" to hit me in the face or for someone to step on my foot with a sharp heel -- whereas in kizomba, the worst that can happen is that we gently bump into another couple who was moving in the same direction, no harm done.

When followers closed their eyes with you, what kind of moves were you leading?
 
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I see girls closing their eyes often, when we dance in closed position. And it doesn't even mean slow and easy dancing. Rather one where both parties stay close in the slot, dancing in place or swapping places. You play with what you got without big steps and spins.

And I bet Sabs can go forever about intricacies of dancing in closed position. Nothing that's possible in k is impossible in salsa. It's just faster and the music is better.
 
Sabrosura said:
When followers closed their eyes with you, what kind of moves were you leading?
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I danced mostly circular, moving around in closed position. Kept my arms connected to their back/waist/shoulders so they could feel my lead.

I did not lead any turns and I kept rotating with my partner. Although turns would have been possible given how slow we were moving.

Often we'd stay in place and sway our bodies to the rhythm.
 
Smejmoon said:
I see girls closing their eyes often, when we dance in closed position. And it doesn't even mean slow and easy dancing. Rather one where both parties stay close in the slot, dancing in place or swapping places.
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How long do you dance in close position?

Smejmoon said:
Nothing that's possible in k is impossible in salsa. It's just faster and the music is better.
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I will have to take an inspiration from Bill Clinton and ask what do you mean by Kizomba and Salsa? :D

To me structurally they are very different dances. Yes, it is possible to change structure of any dance to make it what you want. To me structurally following dances belong in same set:

1. Salsa/mambo, casino, swing family (ECS, WCS, Lindyhop, etc), hustle.

2. Kizomba and Tango

3. Zouk, BS

4. Bachata, Merengue, Lambazouk, etc.

#4 can straddle between #1 and #2.

Urban kizz and Nuevo make the #2 similar to #1 and hence big divide in respective communities about "traditional' vs non-traditional.

Most dances for performances and other reasons can become similar to #1 (open frame). #1 rarely become similar to the rest. Dancing close for a phrase or two is fine in #1. But you are totally changing the structure of the dance if you will insist on dancing #1 in close frame the whole song. You might be able to dance that way with very small selected partners but not with most general practitioners. As they say, it takes two to tango. It takes two to break mold of #1 structure.

I can lead salsa with my eyes close in open frame, as long as the neighboring couples don't bump into me and I avoid certain types of moves and I keep at least one hand connected to the follower. I am sure a follower too can follow with eyes close under the same conditions. But I disagree with a general notion that everything possible in #2 is possible in #1.
 
Offbeat said:
I don't consider that as dancing salsa, anymore than grinding and humping in a nightclub is considered dancing :)
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You need some level of comfortability. I don't do this with everyone. But then dancing is sometimes dangerous, especially when mutual attraction is involved.
 
Offbeat said:
But you are totally changing the structure of the dance if you will insist on dancing #1 in close frame the whole song.
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I am as strict as they come when it comes to Salsa structure but experimetation with those who are willing and able is something I am open to exploring as long as it's still danced to Salsa-like music. But if someone says, 'let's dance Kizomba to this Salsa song' then I won't do it.

Alternatively, the song can also change how I dance. When I hear Toda Una Vida, I don't want to dance patterns at all. I want to hold someone close. But you would categorize me as a dry humper whereas I'd classify it as mutual connection.

After such dances, I've gotten comments like 'that was on another level'. These aren't from beginners either.
 
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Offbeat said:
But you are totally changing the structure of the dance if you will insist on dancing #1 in close frame the whole song. You might be able to dance that way with very small selected partners but not with most general practitioners. As they say, it takes two to tango. It takes two to break mold of #1 structure.
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Yes. The sacred geometry is broken!

Offbeat said:
How long do you dance in close position?
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Until it gets too hot or boring.
 
Chris_Yannick said:
I danced mostly circular, moving around in closed position. Kept my arms connected to their back/waist/shoulders so they could feel my lead.

Often we'd stay in place and sway our bodies to the rhythm.
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Okay I see, so you were actually dancing kizomba :D

I have so far tried leading kizomba to bachata music and it worked very well (and it made the BS sets at that SBK party a lot more bearable), I should start doing it to salsa music also :D
 
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