What was in Prague? You didn’t know ahead of time that people were going there?
Salsa open diary
- Thread starter MacMoto
- Start date
What was in Prague? You didn’t know ahead of time that people were going there?
BACK2MAMBO. An event organized by someone from Dubai.
I knew it was gonna be big, but it exceeded expectations.
Hi all I wonder if anyone ever experienced something like this. Basically, I'm an improver/intermediate, I'm taking min 2 classes per week for around a year, and after changing schools a lot, I settled in one of the best in town, I go to socials a lot as well for quite some time. I joined a new class out of curiosity but when I went there, I didn't like it (they were teaching pure patterns), so I waited for a break and then told the teacher that I'm leaving with a made-up excuse. And the teacher replied with an absolutely genuine question: "Are you sure you don't want to join beginners?" I glanced their way and saw the total beginners, stomping awkwardly in that typical military march, trying to memorize basic step. I was so shocked I didn't say anything but the more I sit here, the more I wish I asked what in my moves is so tragic that the teacher felt I should join them 
tbh I'm not a great dancer but I'm definitely not this bad. The teacher seemed genuine, it didn't look like a revenge for my leaving early. Would you ask?
tbh I'm not a great dancer but I'm definitely not this bad. The teacher seemed genuine, it didn't look like a revenge for my leaving early. Would you ask?
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Hi all I wonder if anyone ever experienced something like this. Basically, I'm an improver/intermediate, I'm taking min 2 classes per week for around a year, and after changing schools a lot, I settled in one of the best in town, I go to socials a lot as well for quite some time. I joined a new class out of curiosity but when I went there, I didn't like it (they were teaching pure patterns), so I waited for a break and then told the teacher that I'm leaving with a made-up excuse. And the teacher replied with an absolutely genuine question: "Are you sure you don't want to join beginners?" I glanced their way and saw the total beginners, stomping awkwardly in that typical military march, trying to memorize basic step. I was so shocked I didn't say anything but the more I sit here, the more I wish I asked what in my moves is so tragic that the teacher felt I should join them
I’d say trust your instincts. I always trusted mine when it came to choosing classes and I didn’t turn out horrible.
You don’t have any obligation to continue taking classes if it doesn’t sit well with you.
If the class didn’t offer you any value, then I would trust that feeling. The teacher trying to down-sell you only works if you respect the teacher.
Even if that school has something of value to offer, they didn’t really give you much reason to continue.
Ask yourself this question: “Can this place offer me something that is lacking in my current class offerings?”
The answer should be obvious. If it’s not a resounding ‘yes!’, I’d be weary.
If it were me, I wouldn’t even have told the teacher that I’m leaving. I would have just never come back. They had exactly one chance to try to convince me, and they failed.
yeah I'm not thinking of going back, I didn't like the class to the point that I rather left mid-class instead of just suffering through it. But the teacher was nice and really trying so I felt awkward leaving without a word. I just can't stop thinking why the heck they thought I should join beginners class and whether I should have openly asked why the heck they suggested that
I probably should, something like "do I look this bad??" in a funny way 
yeah I'm not thinking of going back, I didn't like the class to the point that I rather left mid-class instead of just suffering through it. But the teacher was nice and really trying so I felt awkward leaving without a word. I just can't stop thinking why the heck they thought I should join beginners class and whether I should have openly asked why the heck they suggested that
Write and ask them what they think you should improve upon most. This could be nothing of value, but could be very worthy. Since they seem to be doing the opposite of what you like, they might be good at exactly what you are weak at, since we (humans) tend to enjoy and repeat what brings us success.
Unless you're very talented, hard working, and with previous dance experience, after just one year you're still beginner. It's normal.
I'm taking classes again and these are beginner classes. I'm learning basic steps. Some people are laughing and don't understand why, but I learn a lot. It's not exactly about memorizing the moves or patterns, I can repeat them quite easily. I'm learning the details of execution, positioning, orbits (of Cuban salsa). Breaking habits.
One thing I should work on more is just placing your feet on the floor. Make it tasty, make it musical, connect with the rest of body movement.
One thing I should work on more is just placing your feet on the floor. Make it tasty, make it musical, connect with the rest of body movement.
Hi all I wonder if anyone ever experienced something like this. Basically, I'm an improver/intermediate, I'm taking min 2 classes per week for around a year, and after changing schools a lot, I settled in one of the best in town, I go to socials a lot as well for quite some time. I joined a new class out of curiosity but when I went there, I didn't like it (they were teaching pure patterns), so I waited for a break and then told the teacher that I'm leaving with a made-up excuse. And the teacher replied with an absolutely genuine question: "Are you sure you don't want to join beginners?" I glanced their way and saw the total beginners, stomping awkwardly in that typical military march, trying to memorize basic step. I was so shocked I didn't say anything but the more I sit here, the more I wish I asked what in my moves is so tragic that the teacher felt I should join them
In a group class you’re assuming the teacher might have been paying attention to you or others individually. It’s possible the teacher didn’t observe how you were doing. The teacher probably thought that you were leaving because you were finding the pattern challenging. I will not take it personally. It’s a fail on the part of teacher. Or in your place I would’ve said to the teacher that “I’m looking for something more than patterns to improve my following”.
I get what you mean, in my area they don't teach that. You learn your march, that's it. Nobody absolutely bothers with technique and explanation of how let's say weight transfer works etc. I had to go to youtube for that. And I spent a lot of time in various schools, I remember that many times the teachers had a really hard time when I asked them to explain, which is a bit sad tbh. I can't wait to try some foreign schools when I'm travelling to try out different approach.
Very few teachers in salsa will be able to teach, breakdown, or explain those things to you. Unless you already know they are able to do that. Either through a reference or first hand experience. Some experienced and advance dancers can probably do a better job than many instructors. That’s because most of them haven’t learnt or taught in a mindful way. A lot of younger performers (20s and 30s) teach as a way of supplementing their income. Or could be the main income stream. They were talented and/or worked hard to become good performers. And then use their fame to attract students. Salsa doesn’t have a didactic framework or approach to teach dancing. Which means each good teacher has to invent his/her own way to effectively teach salsa. Finding a good teacher is a matter of luck. But there are certain well known names with whom you can’t go wrong.
Thanks for this, the more I think about it, this makes the most sense. Now I can stop thinking about what was so so tragic about me
Went dancing, and I danced with a girl I barely know. We've danced once before. Anyway, after a few dances, she comes up to me and says she requested a specific song (to be played later) just for us! This has never happened to me. I mean, saving a dance sure but to a specific song that you just requested? My mind was blown.
Was it Dance Monkey DJ Tronky BS Remix?
1derpalm
Son Montuno
I had a similar situation with 2 different latinas... To BACHATA. The irony...
This will be a little bit of a rant, but what should I expect from salsa class? Maybe a strange question but I wonder if my expectations are maybe too high? I'm changing schools for almost a year. I lost count of how many teachers I tried and how many schools I visited. I finally settled in a school that's considered one of the best in town, and I'm not happy, despite it being 100% better than the rest.
What bothers me most:
Most schools teach purely patterns
Teachers sometimes don't know the steps, they have muscle memory and if asked how to do something, they have to quickly perform the steps so they realize how they actually did it. Some of them admitted they don't do salsa for long(usually did different dance before), yet they are allowed to teach
All good classes are desperately overcrowded (50+), with absolutely no space for personal feedback
Some schools actually hold classes in one hall, so one room with beginners, improvers, intermediate people, and advanced people, shouting over each other and sharing music
Students choose what level they are at, so people with strong confidence just push themselves to higher levels, this is causing a big disbalance in class but again, the teacher will say nothing.
All of those points are something that wouldn't be acceptable in my other dance classes, and I somehow hit my salsa low. I'm stuck on my level and I realized, all progress I made lately was thanks to youtube. Is this standard in your areas too, and am I just unlucky? I noticed a lot of complaints here on teaching methods as well so not sure if this is for some reason more common
What bothers me most:
Most schools teach purely patterns
Teachers sometimes don't know the steps, they have muscle memory and if asked how to do something, they have to quickly perform the steps so they realize how they actually did it. Some of them admitted they don't do salsa for long(usually did different dance before), yet they are allowed to teach
All good classes are desperately overcrowded (50+), with absolutely no space for personal feedback
Some schools actually hold classes in one hall, so one room with beginners, improvers, intermediate people, and advanced people, shouting over each other and sharing music
Students choose what level they are at, so people with strong confidence just push themselves to higher levels, this is causing a big disbalance in class but again, the teacher will say nothing.
All of those points are something that wouldn't be acceptable in my other dance classes, and I somehow hit my salsa low. I'm stuck on my level and I realized, all progress I made lately was thanks to youtube. Is this standard in your areas too, and am I just unlucky? I noticed a lot of complaints here on teaching methods as well so not sure if this is for some reason more common
There is nothing wrong in having higher expectations. Nor is it wrong to expect a school that will help you build skills better.
When I started dancing, my scene was easily among top five in the world (perhaps still is). For outsiders, it may seem like the scene had good schools. After first two years, I stopped taking classes because the instructor I liked learning from moved out of town. None of the other schools in the area to me were good enough or could offer me anything to make me better. I practiced whatever development I could through a lot of social dancing. YouTube wasn't much of an option then. Today if I had to choose to take class/learn regularly, there are probably not more than 2 or 3 known instructors I will choose from. None is within 2500 miles of where I live.
You can choose self learning to get better. It is a path that works for some. Some of the best social dancers I know personally are largely self taught after the first year or two. Instead of spending your money in weekly group classes, you can choose to invest it in three or four privates a year with someone that you think will work for you. That may involve traveling to other city or country. But it will take trial and error to find right instructor for you.
As opposed to salsa where I didn't think any of the accessible instructors or schools could teach something useful, when it comes to Tango I have continued taking group classes/workshops on and off for years.
Most salsa dancers don't have realization of how sub-standard the teaching is in general and how soon you hit the ceiling of what gets taught. A few former regulars in this forum changed cities or took a few months sabbatical to go live in another city (mostly NYC) to improve their salsa. I know others in the dance scene who make frequent (once a month or quarter) trips 2000 or 3000 miles away to learn from a particular instructor.
Take one or two aspects every six months. Try to focus on improving those whether through YouTube, or a dance friend at right level, or a private and practice it a lot in social dancing. By practice I mean deliberate practice. Most people practice like going through the motions. That doesn't help. Try other dances to see if they improve your following skills since the is what you goal appears to be. Leading and following skills are transferable across dances. As long as you recognize how they can be adapted to the structure of a particular dance. You might find that it improves your salsa and makes you love dancing salsa more than ever. Or you might stumble into another dance that you start truly enjoying and liking.
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I’m going to come out and say that any McSalsa school you attend will eventually annoy you. They are designed to take your money. I’d say if you aspire to become a good social dancer, then you should not spend more than 2 years learning in schools. Most Salsa schools have very low potential for bringing out your potential. Once you figure out how everything works, you’ll want to start going independent and learn on your own. Most people do this through social dancing and supplementing it with privates or going to special workshops. Some are lucky and get a mentor, but I’d say that’s rare. You could also ask around about helping out in some classes and gain more exprience that way.
Jumping from school to school isn't ideal. I would complete the curriculum in one school then stop with the group lessons entirely unless there are specialty classes taught with a very specific purpose in mind.
The best school I’ve ever seen was run by one person, who took very good care of her students, went out socializing and dancing with them, and on top of that was a very good teacher to boot. But even then, I’d say her students didn’t stick around more than 1-2 years. Having a constant flow of beginners was what kept her business going, not by catering to the advanced crowd.
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From personal experience, my lowest low in Salsa came at the hands of a school. They are evil. They take your money. They tell you what you want to hear, then they crush your confidence with a stroke of their fist. They promise a lot and deliver very little. They are breeding grounds for cliques. They make stupid t-shirts which their students wear to social events. “eg. I dance On2” Or “Mambo tribe”. Really? Who cares.
Some legitimately have to do it as part of their job, but everyday students doing it is cringey.
Run away from schools as fast as you can once you feel you can do better on your own.
Whenever I see people still taking classes after 10 years, I know that they are forever stuck and will never improve past the level of that class.
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@Offbeat @Chris_Yannick is NY actually this good? I saw quite a few times on forum that the scene is really high-skilled there. I wonder why salsa otherwise seems to have low teaching standards globally. I will probably focus on other dances to improve things I know I lack and hopefully will move forward in salsa too. I'm trying to learn alone but I feel it won't get me very far