Salsa open diary

Sabrosura said:
I'm not sure looking at the eyes adds much information about the leading -- one of my instructors actually recommended looking toward the lead's chest to better understand what is being led, since that is where his movement originates (there is also an interesting lead-follow exercise where the follow puts her hand on the lead's chest and he leads her just through that). For me it's easy and natural to look towards the lead's chest since I am usually a bit shorter than most leads. But I look a lot at their face / eyes as well (more than chest usually), but that is more for connection rather than to help with following.
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Ha! what you mentioned here are things that actually bother me. Not you:D, I mean the technique.

"(there is also an interesting lead-follow exercise where the follow puts her hand on the lead's chest and he leads her just through that)."

When I first started dancing, the female instructor taught every girls in the class that if a guy gets too close for personal space or not welcoming, you put a hand on his chest or shoulder front. So if a new girl puts her hands on my chest, my dance is 99% done. Of course, there is a way to put her hand on your chest like she's your lover... you know what I mean.

"I'm not sure looking at the eyes adds much information about the leading"
Maybe in other cultures. But I feel the eye contact is necessary for me. It's the first sign that says "I am here with you". If a girl does not look at my face/eyes every now and then or all the time, or even worse, she looks around, I won't ask her for a dance again.
 
Bostontraitor said:
Ha! what you mentioned here are things that actually bother me. Not you:D, I mean the technique.

"(there is also an interesting lead-follow exercise where the follow puts her hand on the lead's chest and he leads her just through that)."

When I first started dancing, the female instructor taught every girls in the class that if a guy gets too close for personal space or not welcoming, you put a hand on his chest or shoulder front. So if a new girl puts her hands on my chest, my dance is 99% done. Of course, there is a way to put her hand on your chest like she's your lover... you know what I mean.

"I'm not sure looking at the eyes adds much information about the leading"
Maybe in other cultures. But I feel the eye contact is necessary for me. It's the first sign that says "I am here with you". If a girl does not look at my face/eyes every now and then or all the time, or even worse, she looks around, I won't ask her for a dance again.
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Re: putting hand on chest, I meant this is done as a lead-follow exercise in a class setting, not that this should be done while dancing.

That said, one of the leads with whom I have a very good chemistry and connection actually spontaneously gently puts my right hand on his chest sometimes and it really adds to the connection :)

Re: eye contact, actually I think we are in agreement ;) You are saying it adds to the connection and that is what I said as well -- but, connection is a bit different than adding following information. To better clarify the difference: I can follow with my eyes closed as long as as the lead is good, but of course, we then miss out on the visual connection. Conversely, I can look in someone's eyes non-stop but if their lead is unclear, looking in their eyes won't help.
 
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Sabrosura said:
That said, one of the leads with whom I have a very good chemistry and connection actually spontaneously gently puts my right hand on his chest sometimes and it really adds to the connection :)
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Hey baby....
Did I just covert to Islam cuz you soundin' like a Christian infidel...
 
So never thought I'd say this, but...I'm now taking styling classes :bookworm: :D

Starting early on in my salsa journey I kind of looked down on "lady styling" classes and equated them to learning how to do the dreaded pterodactyl hands ridiculousness. I kind of prided myself on my functional minimalistic arm styling, which is what I learned in Frankie's classes. My opinion has long been that styling classes, especially the arms stuff, are for people who focus on the wrong thing in their dancing, i.e. form over substance.

Fast forward to a couple weeks ago, when I was chatting to one of my favorite leads, whose dance views I greatly value. He is Frankie-trained but said he doesn't think Frankie is a good instructor for women because he teaches a more androgynous/masculine arm styling. At which point I'm like...so...this means...my dance arms are also kind of masculine looking. Like a dagger through the heart o_O

So all those years of ignoring styling stuff are now biting me in the ass so to speak...

So it's back to the drawing board: I'm now doing Karel Flores' online lessons, focusing on the styling. I chose her because she is one of the few salsa ladies whose style I really like: feminine yet natural, not exaggerated (I also like Alien's styling but it's a bit exaggerated for me taste). I was planning to only do the styling classes but it turns out all her lessons are great, she gives good tips for technique/body movement, so I actually am now doing all of them, from beginner level onward. #beginnermind as Zen Buddhists would say.

So in the end this whole styling thing will probably lead to overall improvements for my dancing :)
 
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Sabrosura said:
So never thought I'd say this, but...I'm now taking styling classes :bookworm: :D

Starting early on in my salsa journey I kind of looked down on "lady styling" classes and equated them to learning how to do the dreaded pterodactyl hands ridiculousness. I kind of prided myself on my functional minimalistic arm styling, which is what I learned in Frankie's classes. My opinion has long been that styling classes, especially the arms stuff, are for people who focus on the wrong thing in their dancing, i.e. form over substance.

Fast forward to a couple weeks ago, when I was chatting to one of my favorite leads, whose dance views I greatly value. He is Frankie-trained but said he doesn't think Frankie is a good instructor for women because he teaches a more androgynous/masculine arm styling. At which point I'm like...so...this means...my dance arms are also kind of masculine looking. Like a dagger through the heart o_O

So all those years of ignoring styling stuff are now biting me in the ass so to speak...

So it's back to the drawing board: I'm now doing Karel Flores' online lessons, focusing on the styling. I chose her because she is one of the few salsa ladies whose style I really like: feminine yet natural, not exaggerated (I also like Alien's styling but it's a bit exaggerated for me taste). I was planning to only do the styling classes but it turns out all her lessons are great, she gives good tips for technique/body movement, so I actually am now doing all of them, from beginner level onward. #beginnermind as Zen Buddhists would say.

So in the end this whole styling thing will probably lead to overall improvements for my dancing :)
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I agree with your friend :). I also don't think the two need to be mutually exclusive (i.e. "substance" and styling). Let us know what the lessons are like - she's also an absolute favorite of mine.

I myself need to move in the opposite direction :)
 
I am a borderliner. That means I live close to the border of two other countries. That was culturally always interesting, and these days it gets even more so for dancers as every country applies different covid rules. The covid rates are about the same, but the conclusions are different.

Last week news came that Switzerland demands masks now for dancing. That sucks, so I decided to hop on to France to try there. I knew nothing good about it, (eastern) France is lost to Kizomba, but I thought I give these SBK parties a chance. For whatever reason all these parties there happen in kind of fitness centers - yes, seriously. One party I went to was in a squash center, the other in a bowling center. I thought it can't be as worse as it sounds, but it was. The french know a lot about savoir-vivre (the art of living), but sometimes they forget it all and do things I can't believe. The dancers also were - uhm, not so good. What do you do when your follower doesn't know a single right turn? Probably she was there for the bowling and just passed by in the Salsa room. There are four of these places and I have tried two, I won't bother trying those other fitness centers.

So I returned tonight to Switzerland for mask-dancing. At the entrance the lady explained:
"So you have to wear the mask when standing or walking, but not when dancing."
Was she serious? Yes, indeed, I saw on the dance-floor the people dancing without masks. Oh yes, this makes totally sense. My tactics was clear now: dance the whole evening!

I returned glad now, had some great fun dances trying to hit the breaks and am happy about the wisdom of swiss laws. If it stays like this, I won't complain.
 
GentleDancer said:
So I returned tonight to Switzerland for mask-dancing. At the entrance the lady explained:
"So you have to wear the mask when standing or walking, but not when dancing."
Was she serious? Yes, indeed, I saw on the dance-floor the people dancing without masks. Oh yes, this makes totally sense. My tactics was clear now: dance the whole evening!

I returned glad now, had some great fun dances trying to hit the breaks and am happy about the wisdom of swiss laws. If it stays like this, I won't complain.
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It has actually been the same in France until the requirements were tightened last week -- salsa dancing parties counted as sports activities, and you were required to wear a mask while not dancing, but could dance without one (obviously in practice this meant no one wore a mask inside the parties at all).

Re: the bad dancing in Eastern France -- never been there but definitely don't generalize about French dancers based on that ;) I would suggest you plan a trip to Paris instead, best salsa parties in Europe in my opinion.

By the way I went to a party in a fitness center outside of Paris too -- it actually makes sense to hold dance parties there (if you don't have access to a large studio or bar) as you have multiple rooms with great floors available :)
 
Everyone in class today have been vaccinated (20 students?). Maybe there is hope yet. I felt more comfortable not wearing my mask (only in that studio). I know it's taking a risk but damn, trying to dance for 2.5 hours with a mask is quite difficult. It was much nicer. At socials, I will still wear masks though.
 
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Smiley79 said:
Everyone in class today have been vaccinated (20 students?). Maybe there is hope yet. I felt more comfortable not wearing my mask (only in that studio). I know it's taking a risk but damn, trying to dance for 2.5 hours with a mask is quite difficult. It was much nicer. At socials, I will still wear masks though.
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I thought in NYC it is mandatory to be vaccinated to get indoors?

All our dance events are only for fully vaccinated. No exceptions. Two weeks back at the festival a couple of vaccinated dancers tested positive five days after the festival. There might have been a few more but I don't know. Since they were vaccinated it was only mild or asymptomatic. But that was with 2000 people. Last weekend I was at a Tango practica venue that is more strict with its protocols (no food, limited capacity, etc). On Monday night I was informed a leader tested positive. He was fully vaccinated.

In the city we can dance without masks. In the suburbs the masks are still required when dancing. Sometimes people take liberties of not wearing masks at dancing places where it is required (restaurants and bars are required to enforce masks but not the studios) and no one bothers to enforce.

Only thing strictly enforced is vaccination proof to enter any event, restaurant, and bars.
 
Drove to toronto and took 3 classes tonight. A casino class at Abanico, a BEGINNER on 2 class and a shines workshop at Ifreestyle (Carol an Angus were listed quite a bit recently by Aguadulce). The shines class was where my shortcomings were beyond evident. I can mask it a bit in partner work. She said when they do the beginner improved series, that's where ill be put (she said cuz I'm not solid enough at on 2, which I can agree).is be upset if I didn't already feel that way myself, due to body movement.
 
Chris_Yannick said:
How technical do they get about body movement? I've only seen their On2 conversion classes online, but I have never heard Angus or Caryl talk about body movement mechanics.
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A bit... But the game is to be sold, not told. They are going to be offering a classes dor the dancers body movement separately. I jace taken 2 worksgops with her years ago and body movement is at the top of the list for her in importance. And timing. And partner connection lol.
 
1derpalm said:
A bit... But the game is to be sold, not told. They are going to be offering a classes dor the dancers body movement separately. I jace taken 2 worksgops with her years ago and body movement is at the top of the list for her in importance. And timing. And partner connection lol.
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I would be really interested in what Angus has to say. In every school I've taken lessons from, the male teachers almost never said or taught anything about body movement or technique and it kinda irks me because there is a lack of male role models.

I am forced to go online and learn from Youtube/Insta , which is fine, but it always seems like locally there are zero classes in body movement taught by men.
 
Chris_Yannick said:
I would be really interested in what Angus has to say. In every school I've taken lessons from, the male teachers almost never said or taught anything about body movement or technique and it kinda irks me because there is a lack of male role models.
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Don't most of the Yamulee dancers have pretty solid body movement? I bet a student there would subconsciously pick up the movement.
 
Sabrosura said:
By the way I went to a party in a fitness center outside of Paris too -- it actually makes sense to hold dance parties there (if you don't have access to a large studio or bar) as you have multiple rooms with great floors available :)
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Interesting to hear Paris has this, too. The thing is at my place there were still the training bicycles in the room (pushed to the side). At the bowling location it was a normal bowling night with 3 separate rooms dedicated to dancing. For going from the Bachata room to the Salsa room you needed passing through the bowling hall. The ambiance in both cases was not what I would call nice.

Maybe they don't have any other possibilities, but that's hard to believe. I suppose most of the french just don't care - they are used to gigantic supermarkets, artificial concrete skiing resorts and artificial concrete seaside resorts, so architecture / atmosphere doesn't seem to be their worry when they go into leisure.

But yes, the lack of advanced Salsa dancers was more important.
 
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Chris_Yannick said:
I am forced to go online and learn from Youtube/Insta , which is fine, but it always seems like locally there are zero classes in body movement taught by men.
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One part of the problem is: these kind of classes are rarely full. They tried at my schools, but hardly more than 5 guys showed up (and even worse for the school: all of us already had a flatrate, so the school didn't earn any extra euro with it). The same with all kind of advanced classes: they rarely are full. Schools make money with beginner classes, where lots of people show up and pay.
 
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