Salsa open diary

[GentleDancer]

As for dancing: Latin Americans for the most part can't really dance salsa, except for Cubans.

That's normal. In Bavaria nearly nobody wears traditional leather pants outside of october festival, in Andalucia nearly nobody dances Flamenco, and in Scotland nearly nobody blows the bagpipes. It is enough when 1 % of the population do it (or love it) to keep on going these traditions.

You can go to any Salsa Dura on youtube and read the comment sections. Most of the comments aren't exactly saying "Saludos desde Nueva York" but rather "Saludos desde Barranquilla" or some other major city.

Indeed, on Youtube I fid a lot of "Radio Barranquilla" etc. with Salsa. Maybe it's mainly old people listening to it. But as with traditional leather pants it will have his retro trend some day.

The main problem we have is that our veteran teachers don't produce students who dance socially. The other problem is that those twenty-somethings that are becoming teachers are doing the exact same thing, which is teaching classes but not producing social dancers.

But how do teachers produce social dancers? My instructors used to say a lot "Go dancing", they can't do much more. The idea of social partner dance is strong, mainly because people like to meet the other gender.

 

[Chris_Yannick]

But how do teachers produce social dancers? My instructors used to say a lot "Go dancing", they can't do much more.

One former teacher friend would literally take her entire class with her to the club immediately after class. She had a very contagious energy.. She'd arranged rides for her students, travel with her students on the bus and was a rare breed of teacher that would social dance just as much as she taught classes. Once at the club, she'd danced with all of her students just to make sure they'd have someone to dance with. Or she'd drink with them. She could drink anyone under the table. She produced nearly 100% of all Salsa social dancers in my city in the last 7 years.

 

[Offbeat]

One former teacher friend would literally take her entire class with her to the club immediately after class. She had a very contagious energy.. She'd arranged rides for her students, travel with her students on the bus and was a rare breed of teacher that would social dance just as much as she taught classes. Once at the club, she'd danced with all of her students just to make sure they'd have someone to dance with. Or she'd drink with them. She could drink anyone under the table. She produced nearly 100% of all Salsa social dancers in my city in the last 7 years.

You are talking an exception.

Going to socials is really on the dancers. Keeping them coming back to socials is on the scene. You have a good scene and people will keep coming back.

 

[Chris_Yannick]

Going to socials is really on the dancers.

Yes, but teachers have a direct impact on their students' attitude towards social dancing.

If you have a teacher who talks about social dancing, organizes events and regularly goes out dancing, then it's more likely their students will follow their example. You don't have to be as outgoing as my friend, but do something other than promote your classes!

If you have a teacher who never ventures outside their own studio and doesn't show a genuine enthusiasm for social dancing, it's likely their students won't either.

 

[Offbeat]

Yes, but teachers have a direct impact on their students' attitude towards social dancing.

If you have a teacher who talks about social dancing, organizes events and regularly goes out dancing, then it's more likely their students will follow their example. You don't have to be as outgoing as my friend, but do something other than promote your classes!

If you have a teacher who never ventures outside their own studio and doesn't show a genuine enthusiasm for social dancing, it's likely their students won't either.

Most instructors in my area do social dance. It is rare in my scene to have instructors who don't social dance regularly.

I had one instructor last year tell me how he cajoles his students to go out social dancing but they don't (i.e. not as much as he would like). We had a woman's team director that showed up for every social dance, even after teaching her performance team for 3 hours. But only 2 or 3 of her 15-20 member team will show up after the practice. She too would tell how she encourages them to go out. When I was a beginner my instructor had a rule that the students should go out dancing at least twice a week. But at that time we had a great scene and it was very easy to dance twice or thrice a week at venues where there would be 200-250 or more dancers under one roof dancing only salsa.

All our instructors and DJs dance. They are usually around till the close. Most dancers start leaving an hour before the end. Mind you sometimes our socials end at 10pm and some at 1pm. I guess first world problems

Bachata is becoming more popular like what salsa was 15 years back. But you don't find huge bachata events in a week like we used to have salsa events.

Instructors whose livilihood depends on students paying, will teach anything that brings in income. It is hard to argue that salsa instructors shouldn't teach bachata. Those who don't depend on teaching as main source of income are happy to only teach salsa. I am estimating that most of the old guard of the salsa instructors here, have found other income streams not related to dancing.

My observation is that people who try to make profession out of teaching social dancing (or its performance form) generally tend to be younger and don't realize how difficult it can be. As they grow older they realize it is not very easy way to generate income. The best analogy is to that of trying to be a star athlete or pop culture cleberity. Only a very few make it to the top. Those who don't languish if they don't have backup plans. There are a lot of college athletes (which is huge in USA) who end up being bouncers, etc because they didn't make the cut into the profession league or got injured. And of all those who are good players at highschool level, very few make it to the college teams.


I think it will be better if good social dancers with an aptitude for teaching do that than many salsa instructors.

 

[Chris_Yannick]

When I was a beginner my instructor had a rule that the students should go out dancing at least twice a week. But at that time we had a great scene and it was very easy to dance twice or thrice a week at venues where there would be 200-250 or more dancers under one roof dancing only salsa.

It was similar in my old scene when my dance school had upwards of 500 students going to classes per semester! The teachers organized weekly events for their students and it usually attracted 200-300 students from that one school alone. It was like a scene within a scene.

They fostered a community of social dancers and that was probably the best part about being a student at that particular school.

In a smaller city, getting people enthused about social dancing is harder, especially for Salsa. In my scene, nearly everyone is a teacher, but very few new dancers are produced.

 

[Offbeat]

It was similar in my old scene when my dance school had upwards of 500 students going to classes per semester! The teachers organized weekly events for their students and it usually attracted 200-300 students from that one school alone. It was like a scene within a scene.

That's biggest school by a very wide margin! Our biggest school probably had 200 active students any given time. I am sure Santa Rico and Yamulee or Baso during their hey days in NYC might not have touched more than 200-300 active students any given time.

 

[TikiTaka]

Yes, but teachers have a direct impact on their students' attitude towards social dancing.

If you have a teacher who talks about social dancing, organizes events and regularly goes out dancing, then it's more likely their students will follow their example. You don't have to be as outgoing as my friend, but do something other than promote your classes!

If you have a teacher who never ventures outside their own studio and doesn't show a genuine enthusiasm for social dancing, it's likely their students won't either.

True.

Where I currently live the two major dance schools seem to have almost the opposite approach.

School 1: Not so good teaching unfortunately, but organizes lots of social events throughout the week and have classes/worlshops before socials start. They also have a mix of parties and more social dance type of events. Their students seem to become friends and go out together, and the main organizer is friends with everybody.

School 2: has a lot of students and good reviews. But I've never seen the main teachers at any socials. And the people who went to their socials said the level was too low, simply because the students were good in class, but lacked social dancing experience.

 

[Chris_Yannick]

Just came back from a 'social'. I was the only one there apart from the DJ.

But... one of the best dancers (if not, 'the' best) in the city was there waiting for me.

We danced 3 songs and then she left.

I was floored that she waited for me since she was teaching a few hours earlier and probably knew no one would turn up for the social except for me. I wasn't even sure if I'd go since it had been thunderstorming earlier and I was about to call it a night, but something compelled me to go.

I am humbled.

 

[Offbeat]

Back from another absymal social. This is at a bar in the busy area of town. Total dancers - 15 to 18. It appears like this is the only part of the world where salsa dancers are scared to go dancing. Tango is faring a lot better though attendance has slipped there too. Since mid-december, been to four salsa socials and each of them had less than 20% of normal crowd.

 

[TikiTaka]

That's normal. In Bavaria nearly nobody wears traditional leather pants outside of october festival, in Andalucia nearly nobody dances Flamenco, and in Scotland nearly nobody blows the bagpipes. It is enough when 1 % of the population do it (or love it) to keep on going these traditions.

Indeed, on Youtube I fid a lot of "Radio Barranquilla" etc. with Salsa. Maybe it's mainly old people listening to it. But as with traditional leather pants it will have his retro trend some day.

Music-wise, I've found a lot of casual fans view Hector Lavoe, Willie Colón, Celia Cruz, Ruben Blades and Oscar D'Leon as icons. Not so sure about Richie Ray, Bobby Cruz, Cheo Feliciano and Ismael Rivera, haven't heard casual Salsa fans mention them too often. I've found El Gran Combo and Grupo Niche, and Joe Arroyo to be very popular among the regular crowd. Among younger crowds I think Salsa Romantica such as Grupo Niche and Los Adolescentes are more popular.

 

[TikiTaka]

Socials still closed, but got had the opportunity to dance with some friends who also dance salsa

 

[GentleDancer]

Back from another absymal social. This is at a bar in the busy area of town. Total dancers - 15 to 18. It appears like this is the only part of the world where salsa dancers are scared to go dancing. Tango is faring a lot better though attendance has slipped there too. Since mid-december, been to four salsa socials and each of them had less than 20% of normal crowd.

For me it is quite the opposite: the venues are full enough but not too crowded, and nearly no beginners, only the addicted - just perfect for enjoying dancing. I'm fearing the times when all people will come back - I can't stand overcrowded dance-floors, especially not for Salsa. Bouncing here and bouncing there is not my pleasure.

Yesterday I spoke outside with the event organizer and of course he would like to have more people coming. But I enjoy these times as long as they are like this.

 

[1derpalm]

Ataca bad alemana are SUPPOSEDLY coming to Ontario in March. I doubt it as I've been burned twice already with 1 no refund and one move to a different day with local teachers only. So I'm cautious

 

[TikiTaka]

Ataca bad alemana are SUPPOSEDLY coming to Ontario in March. I doubt it as I've been burned twice already with 1 no refund and one move to a different day with local teachers only. So I'm cautious

Bersy was supposed to come to my city. Not sure if it was cancelled or will still happen. Didn't sign up.

 

[1derpalm]

Bersy was supposed to come to my city. Not sure if it was cancelled or will still happen. Didn't sign up.

If canclled, 100 percent refund. My worry is that they will still run it without them. They are teaching 2 workshops. Not sure if 150 cad or so is worth it Tbh. Even if all my salsa friends are going. I still only care about getting my basic body movement better. But I'm spinning wheels. I have decided I'm not going to continue if I can't get the instructor that suits my learning process.

 

[TikiTaka]

Not sure if 150 cad or so is worth it Tbh.

If I spend 150 CAD on something it will definitely not be on a salsa workshop lol.

 

[Offbeat]

I still only care about getting my basic body movement better.

Honestly you don't need Bersy workshop for that. It is beneficial to take that workshop after your basic body movement is better. Otherwise doing what Bersy or anyone else teaching will look awkward when you do it.

Better body movement comes through homework of finessing your isolations. By that I mean hours of solo practice. Like what @Chris_Yannick does. He is an excellent example of how to get better body movement. Once you have it then those workshops can add value.

We have a lot of those instructors that come through the town for a weekend of workshops.75% if the workshop is all body movement. Many attend it and the weekends are popular. Summer perks fly in from other west coast cities for the weekend. But those that haven't had better body movement already don't look good nor smooth. Everyone I know that has better body movement had spent dedicated and purposeful practice getting there. Personally I am a lazy slob to practice solo. So I don't do any of those workshops either.

 

[Offbeat]

If I spend 150 CAD on something it will definitely not be on a salsa workshop lol.

You will be surprised how many people will routinely spend that money on the salsa workshops but not dance socially as much.

These workshops are more for younger (that is under fourty) upwardly mobile, i.e. either those with that kind of disposable income or those who are passionate enough to set aside that type of money at expense of not doing other things. For example some of the more passionate dancers in twenties that I know don't hangout that lot at bars and spend money on drinks. Which is most popular socializing thing among their non-dancing peers here.

 

[GentleDancer]

If I spend 150 CAD on something it will definitely not be on a salsa workshop lol.

Depends if either the workshops are so much fun to expect or if you are determined to work afterwards with the workshop content. Which means viewing the videos again and again and practicing it. But few people ever watch those videos later. In general I suspect these huge classes have not much to offer for an advanced dancer.

I spend 3000+ Euros in private lessons during those two years of Covid times (while I saved money from not doing much else due to Covid). It was well worth it as it gave me lots of positive vibes in sad times and it boosted my dancing (which results in having much more fun now).

But if I would have spend the same amount in workshops I doubt I would have learned so much. On the other hand maybe you make great experiences during congresses, so everybody will calculate different.