Using perception to help your dancing?

[Flujo]

Could you guys post some mental tricks that you use to help you with your dancing?

For example. Say you want to do more in slower songs and wonder how some dancers can fit so much into a slow paced track. Let's say you decide picture them as weaving a tapestry (of moves), which in turn unlocks the metal barrier (i.e, slow song = slow moves) to achieving that. That sort of thing.

 

[SalsaGipsy]

I use a few visualisations but not to help me in my dancing - they are just associations. For example the tension in the couple is sometimes like a spring that is streched and then released (think of open breaks, CBL, etc.) Also the arm movement is like drawing and the hands can be like brushes - the wrist leads the hand the way that the handle leads the brush.

 

[MacMoto]

Maybe not really the sort of perception/mental tricks you are thinking of, but,

- I'm working on the use of my hips when taking steps (again) and am using the same thing I used the last time I worked on it: there's a local dancer I love watching, and I basically mimic her movement in my mind. I'm sure I look nothing like her doing it, but it helps me remember what I'm trying to achieve.

- One of the things I learned when I started leading was how great it is to lead a girl who is consistently centered. A dance with this one girl really opened my eye. When I dance as a follower and feel myself starting to get jerky, I try to recreate how she felt when I led her. Another mental trick I use to achieve the same effect is picturing myself as something on smooth casters.

- Not a mental trick but a very physical one: When I was working on providing connection through my upper back instead of arms last year, I went to the gym every Thursdays and worked my lats. That gave me achy lats by the weekend, and the aches reminded me which muscles I should be using when I followed. Silly, but it worked :lol:

 

[Joy in Motion]

Sometimes when I follow someone who is all over the place, completely off the beat, and/or difficult to follow... I imagine the dance as a spacing game. I always try to place myself complementary to my partner, and I do the same with the music when the partner and the music are not consistent with each other. I think of creating a bridge between two different langugages. When I think of it that way, dancing with a challenging leader becomes an exhilerating exercise/game.

 

[tgharib]

Sometimes when I am leading complex patterns, I imagine the follower going where I am about to lead them... ever since I started doing this a few years ago my lead really improved...

 

[Nicole_de_reve]

This isn't a visualization... quite the opposite.

Strangely, I follow the best when my eyes are closed. With no visual input, my proprioception really kicks in, and I move much better with my partner. I'm talking orders of magnitude better.

Now, with salsa being so eye-contact focused (as opposed to say, tango), you can't do this too much, so I try to limit it to close holds where the guy can't see my face so I don't weird him out!

Learned this one from a swing dancer who only opened his eyes only like twice a song. lol

 

[sweavo]

I don't use mechanical metaphors so much any more, though I do use a sort of "chi" visualisation. I visualise how far my lead is reaching into my partner as a sparkly golden channel. Sometimes it stops near her elbows, sometimes, her shoulder, and sometimes the whole of her is lit up. I feel as if I can work on the "blockage" and reach further during a song.

Another visualisation I use is of character or setting, to drive the mood of the dance. This will get inspired by the partner or the music, and might get symbolised by, e.g. a gangster or fred astaire or a tropical islander. That then informs how I move and how I behave toward my partner. This might shift throughout a song as the inspiration strikes me.

 

[bas]

This isn't a visualization... quite the opposite.

Strangely, I follow the best when my eyes are closed. With no visual input, my proprioception really kicks in, and I move much better with my partner. I'm talking orders of magnitude better.

I can't remember who said this to me but it works for me as well. Whenever I'm learning something new and I'm getting distracted I close my eyes and the distractions disappear. I can visualize myself in an empty place (so for me it is a visualization ) and that helps me a lot. Obviously this wouldn't work in a social setting as I'd likely throw my partner into everybody around us

There are also a couple of girls in that I have danced with who have trouble following and it works for them as well. It is amazing to see, and feel, the difference. All of a sudden they are following like they've never done anything else and follow the lightest lead. It is amazing how much of a difference it makes.

 

[Offbeat]

Strangely, I follow the best when my eyes are closed. With no visual input, my proprioception really kicks in, and I move much better with my partner. I'm talking orders of magnitude better.

This really works when following ! Sometimes I lead A/T with my eyes closed.

 

[barrefly]

Has anyone here, seen "blues" dancing or taken a "blues" dance class. Talk about becoming one with the music. WOW

 

[Flujo]

Sort of. My brother put on some music and did this freestyle, totally improvised, thing that was seriously impressive. He was totally uninhibited and rode the rhythm like he made it. Now I love my salsa basic, but that beats going back and forth any day. The thing is, he's never taken a lesson in his life and doesn't even dance socially. That made it doubly impressive cos it was all spirit; soul and rum, heh.

Great replies so far. "Visualisation", yeah, that was the word that didn't make it into the thread title. Sweavo, at first I read your reply as "Sometimes it stops near her eyebrows", and was like, what? Liking the role playing idea.

Guys, don't you just love it when your partner trusts you enough to close her eyes. Is there a common theme of dancing in the mind here?

 

[MacMoto]

Strangely, I follow the best when my eyes are closed. With no visual input, my proprioception really kicks in, and I move much better with my partner. I'm talking orders of magnitude better

I can't remember who said this to me but it works for me as well.

Yes closing eyes and shutting out all the visual cues/distractions allows your mind to focus on tactile sensations, so you become much more sensitive to what your connection to your partner tells you.

Unfortunately at many of the venues I dance at, it would be suicidal

 

[Nicole_de_reve]

Yes closing eyes and shutting out all the visual cues/distractions allows your mind to focus on tactile sensations, so you become much more sensitive to what your connection to your partner tells you.

Isn't it fascinating how that works?
I'm teaching myself how to do yoga with my eyes closed after a year of doing it open-eyed, and it's mind-bending how much harder it is. Maybe once I get over a hurdle, it'll become much easier? Maybe it's because in yoga you're not in that movement with someone else? Hard to say.

Unfortunately at many of the venues I dance at, it would be suicidal

Agreed! Definitely something I only do when I really trust the person I'm dancing with.

 

[Offbeat]

Has anyone here, seen "blues" dancing or taken a "blues" dance class. Talk about becoming one with the music. WOW

I occasionally go blues dancing. I like it and enjoy it. Like bachata it doesn't really need any classes if you are familiar with partner dancing. It is easy to dance to the blues music with it's slow rhythm. Salsa is far more difficult than blues without doubt. Probably an order or two of magnitude more difficult.

 

[Joy in Motion]

I occasionally go blues dancing. I like it and enjoy it. Like bachata it doesn't really need any classes if you are familiar with partner dancing. It is easy to dance to the blues music with it's slow rhythm. Salsa is far more difficult than blues without doubt. Probably an order or two of magnitude more difficult.

Actually, sometimes dances that appear to be the least structured (and the slowest) can be more difficult than originally imagined. Granted, it's probably easier to jump up and just make it up on the fly in comparison to salsa, but as for real blues dancing there is a lot to it. I always hesitate to compare difficulty levels of various dances. I think they are just difficult in different ways. Some dancers find that dances with more structure (salsa, for example) are easier for them than ones with less (blues) because they feel more comfortable with the structure telling them what they need to do. With less structured dances they feel like it calls on them to be creative earlier on than is the case with a more structured dance. Just a thought... I have dabbled in so many different dances - some with less structure and some with more - and I find there is always so much to each one and that each is equally challenging, just with completely different dynamics.

 

[barrefly]

Joy, you beat me to it. Thankyou.
My daughter found salsa very easy, but could not dance "blues" if her life depended on it. Of course, my daughter has had structured/formal dance training since she was a wee one.
If she could learn to dance such "unstructured" dance forms, it would step up her dancing immeasurably. (maybe one day when she is older.)

 

[Offbeat]

Joy, you beat me to it. Thankyou.
My daughter found salsa very easy, but could not dance "blues" if her life depended on it. Of course, my daughter has had structured/formal dance training since she was a wee one.
If she could learn to dance such "unstructured" dance forms, it would step up her dancing immeasurably. (maybe one day when she is older.)

You have to remember that in blues dancing while some leaders can be individually musical they can't bring that musicality into the connection they have with their partner.

I firmly think that in any partner dancing like blues, swing, bachata, salsa or tango, etc the connection with the partner is first and foremost, connection with the music the next, and then follows all the rest - the dance floor, technique, sequences, yada yada. So if you have a couple who have everything pat down but not a good connection between them on the dancefloor it is going to suck for either one or the both!

Discussing with other dancers (albeit a small sample of half a dozen or so) who are proficient in two or more, social partner dance forms (minus ballroom), the consensus seems that if one were to plot each in terms of degree of difficulty from least to most hard to learn/dance it will be something like:

merengue<blues<bachata<salsa<swing<tango

Of course personally some may find adjacent ones to flip (e.g. bachata<blues).

Now think of adding something like Kizomba and Zouk into that pic.

Another key difference between dances like Bachata, Blues, Tango (& Kizomba) and the rest (salsa, swing, etc) is the comfort with intervention of the personal space due to closeness or close hold/embrace that is largely preferred.

 

[Flujo]

From perception in dancing to the perception of dancing. Interesting.
Just wanted to say a quick thanks for the replies. @tgharib: I'll give your one a try and see how it goes.

 

[Joy in Motion]

You have to remember that in blues dancing while some leaders can be individually musical they can't bring that musicality into the connection they have with their partner.

Can you clarify what you mean by this, Offbeat? This comment made me curious. I'm not sure what you're trying to say so and what you are basing this on. Thanks!

Discussing with other dancers (albeit a small sample of half a dozen or so) who are proficient in two or more, social partner dance forms (minus ballroom), the consensus seems that if one were to plot each in terms of degree of difficulty from least to most hard to learn/dance it will be something like:

merengue<blues<bachata<salsa<swing<tango

Of course personally some may find adjacent ones to flip (e.g. bachata<blues).

I'm not sure I agree with this. I think it is very unique to the individual and his or/her strengths, weaknesses, personal preferences, etc. Being able to relate to the music is a big part of building an ability to dance to it, which is why I think that this would tend to be pretty individual. I am pretty proficient in several of these dances and familiar with all of them, and the only one I can say I kind of agree with is merengue, but actually it might be pretty difficult for some if you consider that although the beat is basic the isolated (and often subtle) movements of the hips, shoulders, etc. that would make it more advanced might be extremely difficult to some people because of how subtle and controlled they are.

I might have to think about this more... Would be interested to hear what others think, particularly those who have built up their skill level in several dances.

 

[Offbeat]

Can you clarify what you mean by this, Offbeat? This comment made me curious. I'm not sure what you're trying to say so and what you are basing this on. Thanks!

I was specifically replying to barrefly on one possibility of why his daughter might find blues slightly harder (poor communication in the lead). I have found in the blues dancing that there are some leaders (particularly those with very poor concept of frame, connection, etc) who get lost in the trance of the music or are able to move to the music themselves very well but fail to account for the partner they are dancing with. Or to put in different words- a leader or a follower dancing to the music without caring or unable to be in sync with their partner.

I'm not sure I agree with this. I think it is very unique to the individual and his or/her strengths, weaknesses, personal preferences, etc.

That may be so, as with everything else. Somethings for some people are easier to grasp compare to other. My point of reference is an overall degree of competence required to become good at a dance, or relative competence of average dancer of a particular dance form. I will go out on the limb at risk of sounding bombastic and make a statement that AT is much harder to learn and execute than Salsa though initially AT is all about walking. What do I base it on? My own experience, experience of at least 5 or 6 proficient salsa dancers who also dance or learn Tango, and a few Tango dancers who crossed over into Salsa. Now will there be someone whose experience is otherwise -sure.

More specifically with the dances like merengue, blues, (and bachata to an extent), as a leader I have and can dance it with followers who are new/non-dancers/inexperienced with a relative ease than when I have to dance say salsa, swing or tango with the same set of ladies. The first three forms are more forgiving (or more tolerant) with respect to the aspects like frame, technique, following the rhythm, body movement, etc. With the latter three (swing, salsa, tango) both the follower and the leader need a certain level of ability and/or awareness of the same (otherwise will end up more like dancing ceroc to swing/salsa music).