The key to having a flavorful basic.. do you care?

[Chris_Yannick]

It doesn't look like Offbeat's calculation is accurate for this clip. People walking moderately usually don't sweat that much (or at all). And we know that a number of leaders have a towel in back pocket (some actually using it a lot, some just as a fashion - which we discussed in one thread)

Interestingly, I don't remember any follower having a towel in back pocket (and recently many have some kind of back pockets for storing the phone), although many of them certainly move considerably more than the leaders

It's not easy to estimate how much energy is actually being used by watching the dance - it depends a lot. Performers usually try looking elegant and effortless, so they might be spending more energy than it looks like. Social dancers on the other side sometimes want tho show that they spend a lot of energy (even if most of it actually isn't spent most efficient way due to lack of technique), which is also connected with those towels ...

So some people probably spend 10x more energy per dance than other when dancing socially and the range is like from walking slowly to running quite fast ...

Yeah, that's why when you watch someone on video, it's not immediately evident how much energy they're expending.

I'm pretty sure guys like Terry are expending a lot of energy. The sweat is one indication. There could be other non-visible factors.

I'm rarely out of breath when dancing, but the quality of my dancing does decline as the night goes on. Some of it is mental exhaustion. It's been a while since I just switched everything off since I'm always conscious of what I'm doing when I dance. I also don't really feel like pushing myself past the point of exhaustion anymore so I usually sit down for extended periods or call it a night.

 

[Offbeat]

So some people probably spend 10x more energy per dance than other when dancing socially and the range is like from walking slowly to running quite fast ...

True. If you are doing a lot of shines that could be equal to any where from a slow jog to a brisk running or a Sprint. But it usually happens in bursts.

I was thinking what is minimum energy one could be spending while not being lazy about stepping.

 

[Offbeat]

People walking moderately usually don't sweat that much (or at all). And we know that a number of leaders have a towel in back pocket (some actually using it a lot, some just as a fashion - which we discussed in one thread)

Interestingly, I don't remember any follower having a towel in back pocket (and recently many have some kind of back pockets for storing the phone), although many of them certainly move considerably more than the leaders

People sweat at different rate. Humidity also impacts how quickly the sweat dries off. I usually don't have towel in my back pocket, but I keep it somewhere close where it is accessible between the dances.

I do know that I sweat far more than an average salsa dancer. My buddy doesn't need to change his clothes during a night and he has fun counting how many times I change my shirt.

I also can dance in a way that I sweat less. I have to reduce overall body movements to do that. Or I can dance such that I am sweaty in a couple of dances.

 

[vit]

I do know that I sweat far more than an average salsa dancer. My buddy doesn't need to change his clothes during a night and he has fun counting how many times I change my shirt.

Do you sweat as much when walking normally ?

 

[Offbeat]

Do you sweat as much when walking normally ?

Yes I do. I find that question funny.

When I said I sweat more than normal, I meant irrespective of type of activity.

You do have to remember that when walking you probably are not surrounded by as many people and have more breeze if you are lucky to live in non-humid places. The coastal cities like Houston, Miami, Singapore, Bombay, Hong Kong, etc are very humid. You can’t walk for more than 10 minutes without getting sweaty. Luckily entire west coast metropolises are non-humid relatively speaking and pretty dry in spite of being so close to Pacific Ocean.

 

[Chris_Yannick]

Here’s a video of a bunch of different linear guys dancing Salsa.
To me, they all kinda look similar until Ernesto starts dancing around 1:35s.

IMO, he’s the only one who has flavorful stepping. You can clearly see his hip movement, which makes all the difference.

I am mostly unimpressed by the others,Terry included. Troy has one of the worst stepping I've seen from a pro dancing Salsa, which is a surprise given he is big on Bachata footwork at which he is excellent.

 

[vit]

Emm ... thanks for specifying the point when Ernesto started dancing. Wouldn't know from description otherwise

But yeah, Troy was indeed a disappointment here. Other are ok ...

 

[Chris_Yannick]

Something I am trying to understand and put more of into my basic is this sort of spongy, springy movement in my legs.

This is an old video of FM where the camera focuses on his legs. His legs are moving in a very sublime, springy, fluid way. The effect is really unique, IMO. It's a quality I find very rarely in Salsa dancers these days.

A lot of dancers can dance fast, but they lack this leg movement and their basic looks very stiff.

 

[dav7802]

Something I am trying to understand and put more of into my basic is this sort of spongy, springy movement in my legs.

This is an old video of FM where the camera focuses on his legs. His legs are moving in a very sublime, springy, fluid way. The effect is really unique, IMO. It's a quality I find very rarely in Salsa dancers these days.

A lot of dancers can dance fast, but they lack this leg movement and their basic looks very stiff.

Hervin could help you with FM lower body movement.

 

[Chris_Yannick]

Hervin could help you with FM lower body movement.

The thing is, modern day Frankie doesn't interest me. Only his old school stuff does. A couple of other guys have similar qualities, like Milton Cobo and Tito Otos. I would still prefer to develop my own individual flavor instead of study one guy intensely.

 

[crzyld]

Here’s a video of a bunch of different linear guys dancing Salsa.
To me, they all kinda look similar until Ernesto starts dancing around 1:35s.

IMO, he’s the only one who has flavorful stepping. You can clearly see his hip movement, which makes all the difference.

I am mostly unimpressed by the others,Terry included. Troy has one of the worst stepping I've seen from a pro dancing Salsa, which is a surprise given he is big on Bachata footwork at which he is excellent.

I think Terry is atrocious in this video. He's dancing in flipflops and makes a point not to look at his dance partner. He has a super bored look, like some of the follows who want to demonstrate that they are way above you. I think the follow would have been justified to stop in the middle of the dance and leave him standing there.

 

[TikiTaka]

Hmm I think an important aspect might just be less partnerwork. Quite regularly I see some guys doing some fun solo choreographies on instagram, and they usually have more flavourful steps than most of the more famous guys in the social dance scene

 

[Smejmoon]

I think Terry is atrocious in this video. He's dancing in flipflops and

Them's fightin' words. It's in Houston; in what else would you dance unless you have proper cowboy boots and want to pretend to be cultured? I do have them, but still prefer to dance in flipflops or barefoot in that climate. To think of it, I've never danced salsa in Houston in anything else but flipflops.

 

[Chris_Yannick]

Hmm I think an important aspect might just be less partnerwork. Quite regularly I see some guys doing some fun solo choreographies on instagram, and they usually have more flavourful steps than most of the more famous guys in the social dance scene

Yes, it's really hard to have a flavorful basic doing crazy hand and arm waving motions. Although there are exceptions (I think Frankie in the above video is one exception). Though generally when the focus is on tricky partnerwork, the steps are often an afterthought.

 

[Chris_Yannick]

I think Terry is atrocious in this video. He's dancing in flipflops and makes a point not to look at his dance partner. He has a super bored look, like some of the follows who want to demonstrate that they are way above you. I think the follow would have been justified to stop in the middle of the dance and leave him standing there.

That's what I call a 'going through the motions dance'. He looks like he's dancing on autopilot, doing the bare minimum to connect to partner or music. This is the kind of dance I would like to avoid myself, which usually only happens when I get tired. Though I have found the value of sitting out when I do not feel like dancing. Terry probably can't do that as much as he would like.

Now that I'm a bit older, I feel like I don't need to dance every single song. It's not a fun time when I dance 30-40 times a night and I'm exhausted for half of those dances. Though I remember the opposite situation when it was difficult finding dance partners when I was a beginner/improver and would have killed having a dance card with 30 partners.

 

[Offbeat]

Now that I'm a bit older, I feel like I don't need to dance every single song. It's not a fun time when I dance 30-40 times a night and I'm exhausted for half of those dances. Though I remember the opposite situation when it was difficult finding dance partners when I was a beginner/improver and would have killed having a dance card with 30 partners.

Exhaustion is not an issue for me. I always had high endurance levels. It is hard to come across a DJ that can play inspiring music to dance to 90% of the songs. Hence to dance 40 songs a night, I have to be on the dance floor for 80 songs worth of time. That hasn't changed with time or age.

Which is also partly why the festivals work for me. More dances with more varied partners.

 

[Chris_Yannick]

Exhaustion is not an issue for me. I always had high endurance levels. It is hard to come across a DJ that can play inspiring music to dance to 90% of the songs. Hence to dance 40 songs a night, I have to be on the dance floor for 80 songs worth of time. That hasn't changed with time or age.

Maybe exhaustion is not the right word. When I'm simply going through the motions, I prefer to sit out. One reason is because I'd rather give my partner the best experience possible. It's nearly impossible to do that 40 times a night. A good night for me now is like 15-20 great dances. I'm there to connect to the music first, express myself musicality and that sort of handles the connection by itself.

I've stopped chasing festivals for the quantity aspect. That to me is exhausting. Also the destruction of sleep habits contribute to the crappy feeling I have all weekend long.

I've mulled over the idea of waking up super early in the mornings (around 4am) arrive to the party and stay until the end. I could then also attend the afternoon social dancing if there is any. Then go to bed at like 8pm and do it again the next day LOL. Though it's hard to justify doing that when I've paid good money to attend a festival. But come to think of it, I would probably end up dancing more and be more awake for it.

So looks like I got a new plan for Sibenik 2021.

 

[Smiley79]

Maybe exhaustion is not the right word. When I'm simply going through the motions, I prefer to sit out. One reason is because I'd rather give my partner the best experience possible. It's nearly impossible to do that 40 times a night. A good night for me now is like 15-20 great dances. I'm there to connect to the music first, express myself musicality and that sort of handles the connection by itself.

I've stopped chasing festivals for the quantity aspect. That to me is exhausting. Also the destruction of sleep habits contribute to the crappy feeling I have all weekend long.

I've mulled over the idea of waking up super early in the mornings (around 4am) arrive to the party and stay until the end. I could then also attend the afternoon social dancing if there is any. Then go to bed at like 8pm and do it again the next day LOL. Though it's hard to justify doing that when I've paid good money to attend a festival. But come to think of it, I would probably end up dancing more and be more awake for it.

So looks like I got a new plan for Sibenik 2021.

Would be curious to see what your emotion was after the previous dance, your energy level, attraction to the current partner, and feel of the music.

 

[Smejmoon]

I've mulled over the idea of waking up super early in the mornings (around 4am) arrive to the party and stay until the end. I could then also attend the afternoon social dancing if there is any. Then go to bed at like 8pm and do it again the next day LOL. Though it's hard to justify doing that when I've paid good money to attend a festival. But come to think of it, I would probably end up dancing more and be more awake for it.

So looks like I got a new plan for Sibenik 2021.

Some people did that in Šibenik; slept during the night arrived to afterparty which is a beautiful time to dance. But then again Croatia has terrible climate, so it's better to sleep during the day anyway.

 

[Chris_Yannick]

Would be curious to see what your emotion was after the previous dance, your energy level, attraction to the current partner, and feel of the music.

What dance are we talking about here? Do you mean in general?

I feel I'm a way different dancer now than before. Can't be sure though until I am in a room full of people with all the physical and emotional stimuli.

It seems that my energy level is pretty good. The thing that is absolutely killing me are my ankles. It's causing a lot of dance outings to end earlier than expected. Also, I've had to stop mid-dance due to ankle problems. I never had this problem before Covid.