Richie Blondet
Son Montuno
Richie,
Tell me when they started to use the word "salsa" in New York!
What you described as far as the term being used in records [ex. Charlie Palmieri] precedes the recording you cited. I wrote it in my post that Marcelino Guerra drops the term "Salsa" in a song called BOB HARRIS, late 1940s. Two decades prior to "Salsa Na' Ma'." That term had always been used by musicians and repeated by their audience.
As far as it being described as an actual musical genre in New York, the late 1960s is when Latino NY'ers replaced the term "Latin Music" for "Salsa." The record companies followed.
Second, jamsessions are nothing new
I didn't write that in my post?
if you would read leonardo Acosta Descarga cubana: El jazz en Cuba 1950–2000, than you would see that's a very long Cuban tradition.
"Decargas" or Jam Sessions are not exclusive to Cuba, nor did they begin in 1950. I already alluded in my post to what Mario Bauza claimed how the song "Tanga" came about. Acosta's book is the Cuban experience on record. Cuba is Cuba. New York is New York. The latter of which has its own tradition of jam and cutting sessions via Jazz.
What is new is the use fo the Cuban rhythms of the 1950s chachacha, montuno, mambo, pachanga and last but not least elements of Cuban rumba (guaguanco, yambu and jiribilla).
As far as what? Meaning 'New' in the context of a jam session?
What is new in the 1960s, latin rock/Latin soul/free/fusion lain jazz even classical music is integrated in those descargas and that's something new, in Cuba Irakere did that. So the mambos of Tito Rodriguez and Joe Cuba based on fast played guarachas and the mambo of Mario Bauza Tanga changed a lot in the 1960s with a new generation and a new sound.
I'm sorry brother but that is wrong. What you define as Latin Rock was not new or was something that emerged in the 1960s. Rock N' Roll is a popular music from the 1950s. It did not take 10 years for latinos to catch up. Go and youtube Mambo Rock and see what comes up. Tony Martinez and Perez Prado were already experimenting such a thing.
Secondly, no one who came up in the '60s followed those people you mention. In fact, those same artists [Tito Rodriguez, Joe Cuba and Machito] switched gears in order to keep up and stay relevant. Tito became a pop singer. Joe Cuba struck gold with Boogaloo. The LP "Machito Con Soul" says it all. And it's all as a result of U.S. American culture and influence. It isn't until the rapers of Cuban music [FANIA]
You would be so surprised at what Chucho Valdes claimed regarding the formation of Irakere. Three things influenced him in particular to orchestrate Irakere when they emerged. Carlos Santana. Rafael Cortijo [specifically the LP "Time Machine."] and the Rock-Jazz Fusion happening in the states [Miles Davis, Joe Zawinul, John McLaughlin, Chick Corea, Herbie Hancock, etc.]
Even using these old songs they started to sound different....
Not really. Maybe in the format they were using. "La Cartera" by Arsenio goes from a Conjunto style to a Charanga version via Pupi Legaretta's band and later Orchestra Harlow. But it was still 'tipico'. Pacheco and Baretto were more amplified. But the instruments didn't make it overall radically different. The difference between the bands of the 50s in NYC was size and electricity. The bands iin the 70s went Electric. But they approached the music the same way the bands in the 40s and 50s did. A combination of Afro Cuban rhythms and Jazz elements.
The credit needs to go to those artists like Willie Colon, Ricardo Ray, Raphy Leavitt, Roberto Roena, Markolino Dimond, Ritmo Oriental, Los Van Van and composers and arrangers like Tite Curet Alonso and Jorge Millet who were truly experimenting and adding brand new sounds and cultural expressions from throughout the Americas.
But as RF Thompson said this second generation of Puerto Ricans still played Afro-Cuban music because THE SOUL OF SALSA is Afro-Cuban. Afro-Cuban music, deep in memory, divides into a rich array of genres—rumba guaguanco, son montuno, bolero, mambo, cha-cha-cha, pachanga, mozambique.The structure of groups is consisting of Cuban percussion instruments, and they use the tumbaos and guajeos which are Afro-Cuban.
Most of the time they did, sure. But sometimes, on those blue moons, they didn't. So what is it then? They're still recognized as Salseros.
My point in bothering with this repetitive debate is to keep stressing that "Salsa" and Cuban and Caribbean music, much like life, is not so easily defined in a nice neat package as how Prof. Thompson, you and a myriad of others attempt to explain it.
If you didn't live in and experience the New York scene during the time frames being discussed and are just going by book knowledge or contemporary articles people write, I'm afraid you're missing out on a lot as far as "the way it was..." in New York AND Cuba.

