The Definition of Sabor!

DJ Ara said:
No need to fast forward, the wonderful track, "La Botija De Abuelito", is one of my all time favorites in the genre (Charanga/Pachanga). I have a couple of kick-ass versions which I play for the "good" crowds. This band does a great job of it too. So, I enjoyed the whole clip.

I hope that people watching these video-clips will finally understand the concept of "less is more", as well as comprehending the fact that the idea of 'sabor' and that of technical ability are not all inclusive faculties. For example, there may be a lady who may spin 50 times in row, but not have any sabor, whereas the lady in your video will radiate the same sabor she is showing us in the clip, while even sitting down and enjoying that same music.

Thanks again.
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Yes, it's a nice song. :)

I don't know about you, but to me this woman's pachanga technique, both footwork and body movement, is really good. :) I am guessing she learned pachanga when it first got popular in NY, so her knowledge of the dance is "first hand". Next time I will ask her to dance with me. :)
 
Sabrosura said:
Something looks wrong with the thread, I think the international salsa scene is trying to hack it..! :eek:

Edit: Realized a moderator moved it to the Videoclips section. I had intentionally posted it in Just Dance, because it was intended to contribute to previous discussions there about what dancing with sabor really means. I was going to also discuss a few technique and style details I observed the dancers used. Could you please move it back? There are other threads heavy on video that were allowed, such as the Musicality one.
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That is because you are a "hater"! :D

You need to understand that "sabor" is a 'subjective' matter, just like everything else in salsa dancing. Things like the music; men dancing in an affeminate manner; people waving their arms all over the place; dancers dancing without space control(respect); people doing backflips; dancers not liking, nor understanding salsa music, but still insisting on dancing to it and even teaching it----LOL...; etc. does not matter, because if they are happy and believe that they are dancing salsa, then in our politically correct and psychologically dumbed down era - it is all salsa! ;)

OK, enough irony.

I second Sabrosura's vote.

To the moderator. I also believe that threads like this will do more benefit in the main Dance Forum, not least in explaining the hard to define concept of 'sabor'. :)
 
Sabrosura said:
Yes, it's a nice song. :)

I don't know about you, but to me this woman's pachanga technique, both footwork and body movement, is really good. :) I am guessing she learned pachanga when it first got popular in NY, so her knowledge of the dance is "first hand". Next time I will ask her to dance with me. :)
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I am not too familiar with that style of pachanga. I am more so in the Cali line, but her sabor, which is a reflection of her love and understanding of the music, makes me want to dance with her, also. :)
 
Here is a kind of parallel, but shorter videoclip from Cali of people just social dancing and enjoying themselves. I am sure that one can find similar "reflections" from other salsa locations, also.



.
 
Sabrosura said:
Something looks wrong with the thread, I think the international salsa scene is trying to hack it..! :eek:

Edit: Realized a moderator moved it to the Videoclips section. I had intentionally posted it in Just Dance, because it was intended to contribute to previous discussions there about what dancing with sabor really means. I was going to also discuss a few technique and style details I observed the dancers used. Could you please move it back? There are other threads heavy on video that were allowed, such as the Musicality one.
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Welcome to Mod re-categorisation! LOL. At least they didn't rename your thread as well to something like "NY Salsa/Danceability". :eek:

And then move half of your clips into it and not the other half... :(
 
Sabrosura said:
I'm sure DJ Ara will add his own comments about the video and how different their dancing is from the "international salsa scene", no need to impersonate him. :p
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I have no intention to impersonate DJ Ara. For one thing I don't have the energy for 2 million posts about Sabor and the international salsa scene! ;)

I'll leave that to the experts. :p

Sabrosura said:
But in all seriousness, yes, totally agree with you--these people's feel for the music is wonderful and the video doesn't even begin to express how amazing it is to actually be there, enjoying the music with them and dancing with them. :)
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I bet. We have quite a few Latinos here including Cubans.
 
Sabrosura said:
95% of the dancers are Puerto Rican/Nuyorican, but there are a couple of Cubans and Dominicans as well.
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Yeah I guessed that from their basics. I would say one Dominican is the guy at 1:03.. he dances a bit like Troy and his style sticks out quite a lot in that group. The guy on the left of him in the suit at 5:10 also.

Sabrosura said:
Curious which dancer(s) in particular look like they have Cuban type movement?
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The first guy definitely, like Terence said, as he has some Son influence in his footwork and his moves are very Son etc. It's quite a close call after that.

Also the guy at 2:28 in the sweater.

I'm not sure what to make of the guy turning himself and the girl at 4:34, he doesn't look like your typical Cuban physically. Though he's very good dancer. He could be NY/PR.. hard to tell as the camera pans away from him before I get a good look at his dancing. He's very smooth anyway.

In general you can tell the first generation from the 2nd/3rd generation dancers.
 
All I can say that for people who really care and want to acquire "sabor", they should surround themselves with people who have this 'sabor', like the ones in the videos, instead of surrounding themselves with pattern monkies, which sooner or later will result in the "100th monkey syndrome"!

Of course, the above suggestion will not work either if the dancers in question - like so many out there - do not really love salsa music either, because at the end of the day, "sabor" is the reflection of one's love as well as the resultant affinity and understanding of the music. Without this sentiment for the music, all one is left with is just "empty shell" musically disconnected patterns.

Now, doesn't that ring a bell? LOL!
 
Splendid video, reminds me of some nights I would spend in Hoagies, the subterranean latin bar in Aberdeen, many years ago. (Obviously on a much bigger scale here! ha)

I think one of the amazing aspects of latin dance partaken of in this way is that whilst it takes years on years to master the movement and sabor and musical intimacy, it's also far more welcoming to folk who have literally no idea what they are doing! It's dancefloors with an ambience like this I learned to dance on whilst sandwiched between Colombinas (what I called my Colombian lady friends back then!), lost all sense of embarrassment and learned to just love the music and taking part in it.
 
i must be missing something, but im none the wiser as to what "sabor" means, "latin american people dancing uncomplicated patterns with lots of body movement" ?

really liked the music in both clips btw
 
!!! said:
i must be missing something, but im none the wiser as to what "sabor" means, "latin american people dancing uncomplicated patterns with lots of body movement" ?
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There are thousands and thousands of people out there who dance "salsa" without any "sabor", independent of the fact wether they are using complicated or uncomplicated pattens. If those people in the video were to do "complicated" patterns, then you can bet your bottom dollar that they would do it with "sabor" and in connection to the music.

In my humble opinion, if you want to grasp this concept better than you should immerse yourself more into the musical side of things, as well as possibly have a second look at the source(s) of your instruction.

!!! said:
really liked the music in both clips btw
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That is already a good start. :)
 
!!! said:
i must be missing something, but im none the wiser as to what "sabor" means, "latin american people dancing uncomplicated patterns with lots of body movement" ?

really liked the music in both clips btw
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Try to watch the clip whilst 'feeling' the music. In this clip, you are seeing a dancefloor dominated by people forming the 'holy trinity' of dance. That being both partners feeling the music, as well as playing off each other. The result is a unique energy, a spice that permeates the room, being created and felt by each and every dancer. Look at the way they are communicating with each other, smiling, their body language is a product of the music and their interaction with their partner.

Rather than being focussed on technical perfection (that doesn't mean there is plenty of excellent technique on show), these people are focussed on living the dance. ;)
 
wildbill20056 said:
Try to watch the clip whilst 'feeling' the music. In this clip, you are seeing a dancefloor dominated by people forming the 'holy trinity' of dance. That being both partners feeling the music, as well as playing off each other. The result is a unique energy, a spice that permeates the room, being created and felt by each and every dancer. Look at the way they are communicating with each other, smiling, their body language is a product of the music and their interaction with their partner.

Rather than being focussed on technical perfection (that doesn't mean there is plenty of excellent technique on show), these people are focussed on living the dance. ;)
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Very nice!
 
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