Salsa Competitions: Good idea or a bad idea?

[brizsalsero]

Hi everybody

Been thinking about this for a while and wanted to get a more balanced view on the subject.
My thoughts are that Salsa is not suited for competition dancing because it is always judged using opinion converted to points and, as always, judments can be biased due to the judge's background.
Were Salsa like a running or car race I could consider them fair contest as there is no doubt as to who came 1st, 2nd or 3rd.
To me the competitions seem more like shows/performances and that is what I enjoy about them. The judging seems superfluous at the end of the night.
Are these recent increases in competitions around the world a sign of a new form of Salsa?

 

[salsero]

I'm not a big fan of competitions, or pre-choreographed salsa in general, though some of the more professional routines/shows can be pretty hot stuff.

And I've seen too many improver level dancers who (possibly with encouragement from promoters/teachers who ought to know better) lock themselves in a room with an "advanced salsa" DVD and rote-learn all the moves and then compete and dance out of time with the music, with poor technique and little real "leading".

Let's leave competitions to the ballroom/"dancesport" fraternity/sorority...

 

[lolita]

GOOD TO WATCH, BAD TO JUDGE

 

[Tony_salvi]

I love to watch the good ones. When a performance hits all the hard accents in a tasteful way, and that's pleasing to the eye, well there's nothing better. It provides me with inspiration to dance all night.

That being said, when did Salsa become a sport all of a sudden? And what I noticed with most casual audiences is that all the things that we dancers love about the dance(connection, musicality, fun, energy) is ignored in favor of the flips, dips, and tricks. Let's not even go into mentioning spinning a girl about 50 times in a row when it doesn't go to the music :roll:

I''m not just talkin about any particluar stye here people..I am starting to see this everywhere. That's why I would like to perform one of these days when I'm a lot better, but never compete.

Edit: Flips, Dips, and tricks are nice if done well. But lately that's all I see in competitions. It's like 60% acrobatics and 40% dance.

 

[peachexploration]

I love to watch the good ones. When a performance hits all the hard accents in a tasteful way, and that's pleasing to the eye, well there's nothing better. It provides me with inspiration to dance all night.

That being said, when did Salsa become a sport all of a sudden? And what I noticed with most casual audiences is that all the things that we dancers love about the dance(connection, musicality, fun, energy) is ignored in favor of the flips, dips, and tricks. Let's not even go into mentioning spinning a girl about 50 times in a row when it doesn't go to the music :roll:

I''m not just talkin about any particluar stye here people..I am starting to see this everywhere. That's why I would like to perform one of these days when I'm a lot better, but never compete.

Edit: Flips, Dips, and tricks are nice if done well. But lately that's all I see in competitions. It's like 60% acrobatics and 40% dance.

Agree with you totally, Tony_Salvi. I didn't vote yet. Can we have an "Other" selection? I think performance is good and sometimes needed for those who are promoting Salsa BUT there is a cutoff. I don't think competitive Salsa, performance Salsa and social Salsa belong in the same ring so to speak.

.....Are these recent increases in competitions around the world a sign of a new form of Salsa?

New form of Salsa? Hmm, don't know. Maybe because of the increase in popularity and the human instinct to make everything a competition?

Sorry, deleted my last post by mistake:

@ Brizsalsero EDIT: No, "too busy dancing to watch" doesn't quite fit because I do like to watch every now and then and do think it's okay in moderation, just not on the social dance floor. If you click on the edit button on your original post, it should let you add it or I could add it if you like but it's really not necessary since I'm the only one asking for it.

 

[brizsalsero]

How do you edit a poll?

Hi peaches
I think that the too busy dancing to watch is the "other" selection.
Does this not fit with how you want to vote?
How would I change a poll?

Perhaps these comps are a necessary component. Perhaps we need them to make salsa accessible for new people through competitions. This would keep the Ego dancers of the salsa community fed with adoration. These egoes are not a bad thing because I think they advertise for Salsa by constantly trying to acheive recognition. Also, comps are what even the most unexperienced can comprehend.

Example: Would the "On 1" category appeal as much to civilians (non dancing personel) as the "Cabaret" category? I think that kind of skill and execution would be lost on them. Why does it have to be called cabaret? Who would want to be called the world cabaret champion? Sorry if I'm overly using Albert Torres' format as an example. It's not intentional, just convenient.

 

[brizsalsero]

If you click on the edit button on your original post, it should let you add it or I could add it if you like but it's really not necessary since I'm the only one asking for it.

It's a valid point and I like it I think a lot of people would agree. However, I can't seem to edit the poll, only the body of text.

 

[peachexploration]

Okay, I added it for you.

 

[peachexploration]

Re: How do you edit a poll?

.....Perhaps these comps are a necessary component. Perhaps we need them to make salsa accessible for new people through competitions. This would keep the Ego dancers of the salsa community fed with adoration. These egoes are not a bad thing because I think they advertise for Salsa by constantly trying to acheive recognition. Also, comps are what even the most unexperienced can comprehend......

Also, I was thinking about something that I included in the "other" category. Do you guys think that sometimes competitions are misleading to outsiders? To give you a more in-depth idea of why I'm asking, see the following: When I first started dancing, I had many outsiders ask, "So, what are you going to do with Salsa after you learn it?" I'm like, "What am I going to do with it?" They were like, "Yeah, are you going to compete and how long before you get to competition level?" :shock: I was like, "Uhm, I'm in it purely for social dancing". They were like :roll: .

 

[salsachinita]

Re: How do you edit a poll?

Perhaps these comps are a necessary component. Perhaps we need them to make salsa accessible for new people through competitions. This would keep the Ego dancers of the salsa community fed with adoration. These egoes are not a bad thing because I think they advertise for Salsa by constantly trying to acheive recognition. Also, comps are what even the most unexperienced can comprehend.

IMHO, while competitions are good advertising tools, they misrepresent salsa to some extend, as PeachE stated in her last post.

People may get drawn into learning salsa for the sake competition only (not that there's anything wrong with it, but) while missing out on what salsa in the wholistic sense can offer. There is a rich cultual/historical context, complex musicality, not to mention a fulfilling social aspect...

All these element can easily be overlooked if one has a sole focus on comps (& being technically competent) alone.

You are absolutely right in saying the comps create an outlet for certain personalities. That's why it DOES have its place, in moderation. So far the examples in Australia have achieved various degrees of success. While comps involve some, they can also alienate others....

If you were thinking of running a comp based in Brisbane, in order to inject interest in the local salsa scene, do it 8) . Be sure to get everyone working together !

 

[brizsalsero]

Hi Salsachinita

I don't think I could handle putting on a comp. Too frustrating.
I agree with the misrepresentation point. I am definitely not a fan and even after competing in several I still hate them with a passion. I think a fair comp can only exist in a healthy Salsa society. We definitely don't have a healthy one in my town.

Salsa is so much more than competition as we all know. Obsession, compulsion, passion, athleticism, connection, empathy, sympathy, joy, frustration, understanding, self discovery, spirituality, acceptance, rejection... it has so many human qualities to it.

BTW did anyone watch the world salsa champs DVD that Albert Torres put out?

 

[salcero2005]

I enjoy competition if its not too comercial. In NYC, we've always had competition whether it was break dancing, tap dancing, the hustle, etc. In the old days, you could go see people at the Palladium compete and do new moves each week. I prefer watching spontaneous competitions as opposed to choreographed dance routines.

 

[Discochick]

I would not enter a competition as I enjoy Salsa socially and would not want to pressure myself. That said, it is good to have something to aspire to and work towards. In the UK (I don't know about other countries) we can take Salsa Medals that get progressively harder as a way of challenging ourselves to progress. It is judged but there's only that person, you and your partner in the room! Not a public arena!!

 

[amo_dile_que_no]

I'm too interested in having fun dancing so I picked too busy to watch. But I would have liked to pick the one just above, competition is not a good thing, at least not for me. I want to be good, to become better, but I don't look around and say I'm better than that guy or so and so is better than I am, so I better get to work on it. Or that I'm not going to show someone a new move I've learned because I want to be the only one that does it (although I might keep it to myself for a week or two before giving up the secret ) . As for organized competitions for people who like to compete in salsa, that's OK with me. I'm not interested in doing it but if they are more power to them. My only gripe is when they have the competition at the club I'm at and they take up the dance floor most of the night. I want to dance!

 

[JonesNikka]

I think competitions are a great idea.
All those people who are always showing off on the dancefloor and bumping into everyone else should be made to enter all the competitions so they could get their 15 minutes of fame with everyone watching and the camcorders rolling.
Whatever it is that makes them feel like they have to prove something could be dealt with at that moment and, since only one of them will win then they will go back to practicing for the next competition but they will do it at home or at a dance school, away from anyone trying to "steal" their moves.
Result: Les annoying dancers trying to carve out a space on the dancefloor to practice their acrobatic manouvers and their choreographed routines.

Besides that, competitions make for great shows.

 

[salsachinita]

I think competitions are a great idea.........
Result: Less annoying dancers trying to carve out a space on the dancefloor to practice their acrobatic manouvers and their choreographed routines.

:shock: 8) :lol: :notworthy: !!!!!

Excellent angle, Nikka !

 

[salsachinita]

.... In the old days, you could go see people at the Palladium compete and do new moves each week. I prefer watching spontaneous competitions as opposed to choreographed dance routines.

Oooooh, I had forgotten about the old days.....

Yes, spontaneous competitions (usually called out by the band or the host of the night) for event tickets or little things like that can be fun !

This way, pre-choreographed routines are kept at bay, and you get to see social dancers doing their thing impromtu to live music...!! Real test on musicality & connection .

* yours truly have won a couple of these, back in the days *

 

[marques]

I have written an articles about salsa tricks and my own experience in a local salsa competition. Feel free to take a quick look. On my salsa blog there is a video clip of me performing at a local dance competition. I only had 2 and half weeks to put a routine together, but I felt that we did a good job with the time given. As for tricks and lifts during social dancing I have written an article describing my thoughts on tricks in social dancing.

Conclusion, I am for salsa competitions, but they need to be more balance (salsa, musically, tricks, etc). The Mayan Salsa Competitions does a poor job at representing salsa and is all about the aerials and lifts (go Alex Da Silva!).

Sometimes is it better to take one step back before going 2 steps forward.

 

[PielCanela]

Conclusion, I am for salsa competitions, but they need to be more balance (salsa, musically, tricks, etc). The Mayan Salsa Competitions does a poor job at representing salsa and is all about the aerials and lifts (go Alex Da Silva!).

Sometimes is it better to take one step back before going 2 steps forward.

good point !!

 

[PielCanela]

.... In the old days, you could go see people at the Palladium compete and do new moves each week. I prefer watching spontaneous competitions as opposed to choreographed dance routines.

that is a fantastic concept !!!