Professional dancers in salsa

B

bailar y tocar

Son Montuno
Who is a professional and why ?
Is it someone who teaches ? Is it someone who performs and gets paid for performances ? Is it someone who owns a studio and draws most of their income from dance related activities ?

IMO, its all of the above to some extent, but unlike ballroom which has specific rules and a governing body that enforces them (just like golf), the boundaries are very fluid in salsa.

There are many professional dance instructors in salsa that I would categorize as amateur performers.

There are many professional dance entrepreneurs (studio owners, venue promoters etc. etc.) that I think are amateurs in the instruction and performance categories.

Why care ? Its about expectations: Who should get paid how much for what.
 
I've seen this topic come up on many other dance forums and, like the myriad "on1, on2, on whatever" topic, I think it's been brought up, discussed and argued about ad nauseum.
 
bailar y tocar said:
Why care ? Its about expectations: Who should get paid how much for what.
Click to expand...

In a free, unregulated market - a seller will get whatever they can negotiate from a buyer.
 
bailar y tocar said:
...There are many professional dance instructors in salsa that I would categorize as amateur performers.

There are many professional dance entrepreneurs (studio owners, venue promoters etc. etc.) that I think are amateurs in the instruction and performance categories.

Why care ? Its about expectations: Who should get paid how much for what.
Click to expand...

In my opinion professionals are those who are continuously improving the service they give their clients, be it performance dance or instruction; and therefore can market their skill for financial compensation.

Opposithe them there are those who improve themselves only to the point of being above average and then try to cash in on the lack of information/choices of those new to the scene, usually above value.

And it is not just about how much they should get paid, it is about the service they perform for their clients.

In my experience, most good performers are lousy at teaching and although I pay good money to see them on stage at a congress, I would never spend a dime on them in a dance school. And viceversa.
 
bailar y tocar said:
Who is a professional and why ?


There are many professional dance instructors in salsa that I would categorize as amateur performers.

There are many professional dance entrepreneurs (studio owners, venue promoters etc. etc.) that I think are amateurs in the instruction and performance categories.
Click to expand...


There is a definitive answer to para. 1-- Any person who derives and or is paid for their services in the performance of dance, either from teaching, demonstrating or any activity for which they are paid .


Para 2---- Very true



para 3-- That is not a requisite for a good business mind ( owning, etc. )
 
I agree with Terrence - a simple definition of a professional (as opposed to an amateur) is that they are paid to do what they do. There are lots of professions that haven't got any regulatory bodies/rules/certification/etc., where the only difference between a pro and an am is whether or not they get paid.

It's true that there are plenty of salsa teachers who could not be considered professional performers, but there is no requirement for a teacher to be a performer too. As Nikka says, ability to perform doesn't guarantee an equal ability to teach; these are two very different skill sets.

And while there are many salsa teachers of questionable teaching ability, the fact remains that there are people who are willing to pay fees to be taught by them, whether through ignorance (it can be hard for someone who doesn't know any salsa to judge whether their teacher is any good) or lack of choice (small town, no other salsa teachers/classes within 50-mile radius)...
 
MacMoto said:
(it can be hard for someone who doesn't know any salsa to judge whether their teacher is any good)
.
Click to expand...


You nailed that one !!

More accomplished teachers within reach , does not always guarantee a change of venue for the student .

Much is dependant on convenience , and other determining factors (Friends, transport etc . ) .
 
Though my 14 yr. old daughter has been paid many times to perform and has taught for money, I would not consider her a professional. She is on a "professional" dance team and at this moment is performing at a paying gig in Las Vegas. She also has a talent manager and agent. I would consider a dancer to be professional when they are able to financially support themselves (to a large degree) with dance...or at least not looking to dad for money LOL. I consider her a talented "aspiring" dancer.
 
barrefly said:
Though my 14 yr. old daughter has been paid many times to perform and has taught for money, I would not consider her a professional. She is on a "professional" dance team and at this moment is performing at a paying gig in Las Vegas. She also has a talent manager and agent. I would consider a dancer to be professional when they are able to financially support themselves (to a large degree) with dance...or at least not looking to dad for money LOL. I consider her a talented "aspiring" dancer.
Click to expand...



Then would you say ALL child actors , Hanna Montana , are not Pros ?

Age has no relevance to ones Amat. or Prof. status if deriving income from a specific activity .
 
Terence2, I am surprised that since you quoted me, you did not actually read the quote.
I would consider a dancer to be professional when they are able to financially support themselves
Click to expand...

I think many use the term "professional" loosely depending on how it is applied. As a dancer, it may refer to one's level of expertise/skill...as there are plenty of "pro." salsa teams/performers, but the dancers actually recieve little or no money or compensation for their performances. One's notoriety as a dancer, or winning big "pro" comps., may give them credence to be called pros. Such dancer's deserve to be called pros in my opinion, but for me...that would mean little. When I know my daughter can support herself with her dancing.....I will consider her a professional.
There may also be professionals that actually have very little or no talent. i.e. professional models.
In business, a professional may have a different meaning.

Added: Though I would love for my daughter to make a decent living from her dancing,.....I hope, with all my heart, she achieves a level of artistry/beauty as a dancer that woud give the world (specifically me) the greatest pleasure seeing her perform. If she attains this instead of (fame/fortune) success,....I will always applaud/support her.

P.S.,....I am a little mad at myself today. I let my daughter go to Las Vegas to perform, get away from me and just have a good time,....then, I get a call this morning with an opportunity for her to perform on t.v. (today) to partner one of the big names in L.A. salsa. She is going to be mad at me when she finds out....but I am trying the best I can. I know she is having a blast in Vegas.
 
barrefly said:
P.S.,....I am a little mad at myself today. I let my daughter go to Las Vegas to perform, get away from me and just have a good time,....then, I get a call this morning with an opportunity for her to perform on t.v. (today) to partner one of the big names in L.A. salsa. She is going to be mad at me when she finds out....but I am trying the best I can. I know she is having a blast in Vegas.
Click to expand...

Wow! Congratulations to her on that! Too bad about missing it.
 
If you're good enough to make a living out of something you're at a professional level, or standard.., but you're not a professional unless you choose to have it as your profession.

No matter how lousy you are at something, if you actually get others to pay you enough for you to choose to make a living of it, you are a professional, not necesserily at a professional level, or standard.

Who's on a professional level is a matter of opinion, if your'e a professional it's a statement of facts.
 
Gemini1357 said:
Who's on a professional level is a matter of opinion, if your'e a professional it's a statement of facts.
Click to expand...




NOT true. In the b/room world there is very strict delineation .

Even to the point of competing profs who never teach .Its based on skill level thru examination, and or, earnings derived from same .
 
barrefly said:
Terence2, I am surprised that since you quoted me, you did not actually read the quote.
I would consider a dancer to be professional when they are able to financially support themselves
Click to expand...

I
Click to expand...

I DID read your quote.

Professional status does not mean literally supporting yourself from the activity, only that one accepts remuneration in monetary or " kind ".

There are numerous Pro,s who in the past ( and some today ) who were not in the profession on a full time basis, and had regular jobs outside the profession.

Again, would you not consider a struggling actor, musician etc. who had to support their craft with other types of work, Pros ?-- dont think they would consider them selves Amat !
 
Terence2 said:
Gemini1357 said:
Who's on a professional level is a matter of opinion, if your'e a professional it's a statement of facts.
Click to expand...




NOT true. In the b/room world there is very strict delineation .

Even to the point of competing profs who never teach .Its based on skill level thru examination, and or, earnings derived from same .
Click to expand...

I don't see how the fact that their skill level is examined through examination changes anything, it's still just an opinion, however well founded. Money is money.
 
I dont make the rules. I just report them.


What you see and what I see doesnt count . I HAVE to abide by them
 
barrefly said:
...I think many use the term "professional" loosely depending on how it is applied.
Click to expand...

Regardless of their level, if they get paid, they are considered professionals.
Amateur competitions NEVER give prize money, just medals or trophies, precisely to distinguish the professionals from the amateurs.

barrefly said:
As a dancer, it may refer to one's level of expertise/skill...as there are plenty of "pro." salsa teams/performers, but the dancers actually recieve little or no money or compensation for their performances. One's notoriety as a dancer, or winning big "pro" comps., may give them credence to be called pros. Such dancer's deserve to be called pros in my opinion, but for me...that would mean little.
Click to expand...

Indeed. They are not professional dancers unless and until they take the money.
What they should be called before that fact is : Champions, advanced, virtuosos, or just plain good or better dancers. Not pro's

barrefly said:
There may also be professionals that actually have very little or no talent. i.e. professional models.
Click to expand...

Believe it or not, it actually takes talent -not just the right kind of body- to be a model, especially a professional one.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top