Dancing difference - EU and USA

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Offbeat

Son Montuno
The insta video posted in the other thread reminded me of differences in experience when dancing in EU and USA. I will speak more as a leader. Also jives with what other USA based leaders have to say about dancing in Europe. Yeah we have often discussed new agey stuff that’s more popular with some dancers in the EU, DJ’s choice of musi, higher quality dancing at festivals in the EU, and related popularity of festivals amongst high level dancers.

This video posted by @MamboJazz reminded me of another stark difference:

MamboJazz said:
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Most of you probably won’t be able to tell.

Her eyes are following the leader all the time or most of the time. And she is smiling a lot (relatively). In the USA followers don’t look at the leader and leaders don’t look at followers as much as in EU. Also there is a lot less smiling going on in the USA. Third is lip singing or actual singing - more common with followers in the USA.

I haven’t danced in EU since 2022. So this could be a bit dated.

This follower’s eyes and smile looked familiar but I am certain I never seen her in person or danced with her. She is probably new? Unless I am not able to recognize someone known (to me).
 
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Offbeat said:
Her eyes are following the leader all the time or most of the time. And she is smiling. In the USA followers don’t look at the leader and leaders don’t look at followers as much as in EU. Also there is a lot less smiling going on in the USA. Third is lip singing or actual singing - more common with followers in the USA.
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I suspect that's directly related to the way larger latino population. Much more singing much less eye contact here locally when dancing with latinas. But also close to 0% latina ratio among linear dancers.
 
Offbeat said:
Her eyes are following the leader all the time or most of the time. And she is smiling a lot (relatively). In the USA followers don’t look at the leader and leaders don’t look at followers as much as in EU. Also there is a lot less smiling going on in the USA. Third is lip singing or actual singing - more common with followers in the USA.
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Hot take. Dancers in the USA are mean and dancers in the EU are perfect smiley angels. LOL.

There are plenty of non smiley people who dont look at each other in the EU too.

I always go back to the non performative aspect as the main difference in attitude. When people aren't on a team, then social dancing becomes their sole purpose. They behave more genuinely, don't put on as many fake smiles, and can grow to become more comfortable in their own skin.

I was watching a lot of videos from Italy recently and I see that performance attitude show up in their social dance videos.

But if I switch on a marathon video from anywhere else, then the warm fuzzies come back.
 
Offbeat said:
Her eyes are following the leader all the time or most of the time. And she is smiling a lot (relatively). In the USA followers don’t look at the leader and leaders don’t look at followers as much as in EU. Also there is a lot less smiling going on in the USA. Third is lip singing or actual singing - more common with followers in the USA.
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Well, she is an over-the-average smiling person, and in this case dancing with her husband so smiling even more. But yes EU followers tend to smile at you when they like your leading. Famously americans smile at lot in public while this is not the case in northern EU - so I guess americans have already smiled enough during the day when they enter the dancefloor while northern europeans may smile on the dancefloor for the first time that whole day. The unspoken rules of when smiling is good manner and when not can be confusing in different parts of the world.

For lip singing to salsa you need some spanish knowledge. There are more latinas in US than in europe so I guess that's why you get more lip singing to salsa in US. On the other hand on european WCS floors the followers often sing the lyrics along because they all understand english. That's also the reason why anglophone songs have worldwide the advantage over non-anglophone songs (except latin america of course).
 
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I'm actually quite surprised how many non latina Europeans lip sync to Salsa music. In my experience, the number is higher than one might think. So is the number of Europeans in the Salsa scene who have a rudimentary knowledge of Spanish.

But let's consider what lip synching/singing means.. If you only know 2-5 words but those words repeat over and over in the song, does it count as lip synching? Because I would say at least a quarter of my regular dance partners do this.

If we're talking full singing with all the lyrics, then the number is much lower.

Also, look at this cult of non latinos singing. It's damn near the whole room that's singing.


P.S. It's tongue in cheek. I know they just know the song because it's their national anthem at this Romantica-thon.
 
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I've danced in EU and US and would say each area has quite different scenes so very few generalizations can be made.
1) live bands - common in US, rare treat in EU. This trickles down to the dance floor.
People in US (outside studio bubble) are more comfortable with live band environment. There are many aspects. Various speeds of music, chattering and crowd engagement, various musical styles in one event, various lengths of songs, in general longer, more improvisation. If band plays originals, then all music from same band. If covers then they often are worse than originals, but sometimes better.
This also means there will be people who don't care too much about dancing, don't want to dance in couples, don't want to dance with strangers, etc.
Some hate it, some love.
2) US has more Latinos who have salsa as part of identity, which means they know/prefer some songs, might not prioritize dancing or work on dancing skills, they will spend more effort on costumes though.
In general just hearing some salsa in your community doesn't catch up with someone who dedicated years of focused studies, but it's a head start. What I enjoy in US and Latin America in general is that people have wider perception of salsa. It's a culture of many layers.
In EU there are plenty of scenes where serious social dancer will know salsa music better than US Latino, who just goes to party. Spain, Romania, marathons would be first examples from recent memory.
3) on average people in EU prefer slower music, and salsa romantica. Part of it is different dancing style, age, but I'm not sure. Most definitely in both of these areas people prefer slower music than in Cali.
3) on average dancers are more connected in EU than US, emotionally, physically, dance skill in this regard is much higher than in the US.
4) In general US has this performance culture, but Italy, Greece has it as well. What I've not seen US is high level socal dancing scene (I've heard stories of old ages, but everything was better in old ages obviously). People who want to dance as Europeans travel to Europe and these usually are best leads in US. (this is what ladies say)
5) pricing /affordability is very different. Flights are cheaper in EU, in US people tend to drive a lot. Prices are bigger in US. Then again US has many free of charge open airs, open concerts, so there are probably people who don't pay much and still have plenty of dancing.
6) In EU reasonably good dancers will reasonably well dance all major styles, to all kinds of music. In US there often is either narrow musical selection, or people are comfortable to narrow dance styles. It was the case in EU 20-15 years ago, probably there are still pockets. I visited smaller English towns last year, people came to me and asked to dance on2, because they don't get much practice.
But small events /locations are exactly those where eu/us talk makes no sense, they're all different. few people set the trends and when they move on some others set trends.
7) I have a feeling that in EU more DJs actually dance than in US, so music they play is better suited for dancers and they feel dancers a bit better.
 
Chris_Yannick said:
I'm actually quite surprised how many non latina Europeans lip sync to Salsa music. In my experience, the number is higher than one might think. So is the number of Europeans in the Salsa scene who have a rudimentary knowledge of Spanish.

But let's consider what lip synching/singing means.. If you only know 2-5 words but those words repeat over and over in the song, does it count as lip synching? Because I would say at least a quarter of my regular dance partners do this.

If we're talking full singing with all the lyrics, then the number is much lower.

Also, look at this cult of non latinos singing. It's damn near the whole room that's singing.


P.S. It's tongue in cheek. I know they just know the song because it's their national anthem at this Romantica-thon.
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Ahahaha, I was there. It was anthemized later as a bad joke, but it caught on and became a meme. It's just room of people who know a lot of salsa songs. From EU obviously, but also many other countries and continents.
 
Smejmoon said:
Ahahaha, I was there. It was anthemized later as a bad joke, but it caught on and became a meme. It's just room of people who know a lot of salsa songs. From EU obviously, but also many other countries and continents.
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I checked. At least 6 people from US were in that event. Another reason not to stereotype too early.
 
I am a follower and never danced in the US, but I noticed that US dancers are always really friendly at festivals. They often compliment or ask for your name or where you are from. Some of the are excellent, some are more average, but either way I really enjoy dancing with them.
There are also friendly dancers from EU and other other countries, but I see this more with people from the US.
 
For bachata, the US followers seem okay with simpler steps and moves. More close hold and less flashy dips in my experience.
 
Chris_Yannick said:
Hot take. Dancers in the USA are mean and dancers in the EU are perfect smiley angels. LOL.
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LOL.

Many USA based leaders who have danced in Europe do say that the followers in the USA tend to have attitude. As I mentioned in is over all experience or perception they come back with.


Chris_Yannick said:
There are plenty of non smiley people who dont look at each other in the EU too.
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As there are smiley dancers in the USA. But far more likely to encounter in EU.

Not only the hardcore and regular dancers, I am also including a lot of casual dancers who like going out to club for salsa dancing. They usually avoid places where studio trained folks take dancing seriously.


Chris_Yannick said:
But if I switch on a marathon video from anywhere else, then the warm fuzzies come back.
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Interesting comparison.
 
MamboJazz said:
For lip singing to salsa you need some spanish knowledge.
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There was a typo. It should have been more lip singing and actual singing in Europe. Have made that observation in older posts somewhere.

MamboJazz said:
There are more latinas in US than in europe so I guess that's why you get more lip singing to salsa in US.
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Not really. They may known the sing but far less sing along when dancing here.

MamboJazz said:
On the other hand on european WCS floors the followers often sing the lyrics along because they all understand english.
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WCS followers hardly sing here when dancing. They try to be more expressive with the dancing when they know the song. I haven’t dance WCS in Europe, so personally do not have a comparison.

 
Offbeat said:
Her eyes are following the leader all the time or most of the time. And she is smiling a lot (relatively). In the USA followers don’t look at the leader and leaders don’t look at followers as much as in EU. Also there is a lot less smiling going on in the USA. Third is lip singing or actual singing - more common with followers in the USA.

I haven’t danced in EU since 2022. So this could be a bit dated.

This follower’s eyes and smile looked familiar but I am certain I never seen her in person or danced with her. She is probably new? Unless I am not able to recognize someone known (to me).
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If I am not mistaken those 2 are a couple so this might explain extra smiles and connection
 
WellHelloThere said:
Not sure about the rest of the US but the music in NYC is so fast campared to Europe.

Mid>slow>>>fast pace for me
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The DJs from popular on2 socials around the USA do play faster tempo and more hard hitting music than at EU festivals. It is not only NYC thing. It is another USA/EU difference. Also the type of songs that get repeat plays can be different.

I am restricting to on2 socials because that’s more apples to apples comparison with popular EU socials and marathons.
 
Chris_Yannick said:
I'm actually quite surprised how many non latina Europeans lip sync to Salsa music. In my experience, the number is higher than one might think. So is the number of Europeans in the Salsa scene who have a rudimentary knowledge of Spanish.

But let's consider what lip synching/singing means.. If you only know 2-5 words but those words repeat over and over in the song, does it count as lip synching? Because I would say at least a quarter of my regular dance partners do this.

If we're talking full singing with all the lyrics, then the number is much lower.

Also, look at this cult of non latinos singing. It's damn near the whole room that's singing.


P.S. It's tongue in cheek. I know they just know the song because it's their national anthem at this Romantica-thon.
Click to expand...
I swear every eutopeannive met in havana knows all the words to every cuban song. Makes for a great experience. Except for the swedes lol. Everyone else seems to like me lol.
 
Dancing difference EU vs USA?
I cannot speak to comparing congresses, marathons and on2 socials. I have never been to a congress or marathon in Europe. The only time I have ever been to an on2 social in NYC was when they advertised a salsa caleña performance team and so I danced with all of the salsa caleña dancers who came that night i.e. not representative.

Otherwise: the variety of levels, ages, skills, DJ quality, venue quality etc etc is at least as great in the US as it is in all of Europe.

That said, I find the similarities between people who dance and enjoy salsa to be far greater than the differences. I find it to be an awesome way to connect to people that I never met before and will probably never meet again.

I would even go so far to say that the people with whom I have danced salsa in Germany, Austria, France, Italy, Spain, Czech Republic (the countries in Europe in which I have danced salsa) are more like the people with whom I have danced salsa in the US than like the other people in their respective countries.

This even extends to Cali Colombia where salsa IS the culture of the city. The salseros there are more like me and other salsa dancers and less like other people in Cali.

I think we may be a tribe all to ourselves :wacky:.
 
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