bachata dance evolution

S

steelhead52

Changui
Dear dance experts,

I wonder if some ppl can help me develop a historical and comparative perspective on bachata dance. Did it develop basically as a set of borrowed moves from salsa, son, bolero etc. adapted to bachata’s medium tempo? Or should it be regarded as a unique invention of the Dominican “street” (or even countryside?), drawing on distinctively Dominican moves, some from their particular way of dancing son, salsa etc.? And now that the dance studios teach it, is there emerging a significant difference between studio-vs-street (or gringo-vs-Dominican) styles, analogous to on-1 vs. on-2? (Or is it just that the ‘studio’ style is more elaborate and standardized?)
 
If you were to go to the DR and into each town, you would get 10 versions of Bachata and the older people in each town would speak of variations of those.

The best analogy is something like soccer or baseball. You probably had your own version growing up. In my town, if we kicked the ball over the hedge on to the street, the other team got a penalty shot. We also had a rule if one team was winning by three goals, then the other team could switch a player. There was no time keeping. No referees. Etc. I remember being on vacation and playing soccer with kids at a campground and surprised they didn't play by the rules ( everyone had their own).

It is too easy to read some official version of a dance, like a sport, and assume that's how everyone did it in the real world of the real people. Bachata is localized in the DR.

The same with Salsa. Different villages in Cuba have different moves and their own history of dance.
 
Interesting interview with José Manuel Calderon, the creator of Bachata.

Some interesting highlights:
- He was a young guy playing music on the street, playing "musica de guardia" or "musica de cuero", which basically meant what people played on the street
- Bolero's already used bongos, guitars, and maracas, however, he also started using the guira
- "Bachata" was first a label used to denigrate this type of music
- Anthony Santos and Luis Vargas were the ones to really make Bachata the distinct rhytm that it is
 
steelhead52 said:
And now that the dance studios teach it, is there emerging a significant difference between studio-vs-street (or gringo-vs-Dominican) styles, analogous to on-1 vs. on-2? (Or is it just that the ‘studio’ style is more elaborate and standardized?)
Click to expand...

Yes, we call it BS and it ravaged the Bachata world to the point where new dancers don't know what Bachata is supposed to sound like because of the emergence of crappy remixes perpetuated by none other than the king himself, DJ Tronky.
 
steelhead52 said:
And now that the dance studios teach it, is there emerging a significant difference between studio-vs-street (or gringo-vs-Dominican) styles, analogous to on-1 vs. on-2?
Click to expand...

Bachata sensual is a European invention so definitely not Latin American and imo not street either. However if studio v street (or gringo v Latin) is supposed to be analogous to salsa on 1 v salsa on 2, which form of salsa do you consider to be studio/gringo?
 
Chris_Yannick said:
Yes, we call it BS and it ravaged the Bachata world to the point where new dancers don't know what Bachata is supposed to sound like because of the emergence of crappy remixes perpetuated by none other than the king himself, DJ Tronky.
Click to expand...

And people who have danced salsa for many years have never danced to music from NY, PR or S America, other than the occasional Marc Anthony track.
 
Sabrosura said:
From the series: is it sensual bachata or... :p

Is he trying to strangle her, or is he dancing sensual bachata?

View attachment 3949

Note: This screenshot is taken from an actual sensual bachata video :p
Click to expand...

From that angle, it looked like a choke defense exercise not "dancing." My first reaction to seeing that for a blink was "why are we posting self-defense stuff on SF? My second reaction was "she's doing the technique incorrectly." Then I read the full thing and thought "wtf..."
 
https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=969857290570394

A powerful public complaint from a woman who quit (sensual) bachata about the huge issues with it in the US.

Key words: bad technique, lack of understanding of how the body and joints move, doing kung fu with the follow's body, using force to bend the follow into positions that just don't work for the human body.

This feels so validating :bookworm:
 
I feel for her, and enjoyed the rant, but this stuff (to a lesser extent) has been going on for years in salsa. Especially in your "tourist" latin clubs where drunk college kids show up and grind on the dance floor and/or do cringe-worthy turn patterns.

When latin dance is always marketed as "sexy" and "sultry" this is what you get in a repressed culture.

Just another phase in the devolution of BAD (Bad American Dancing) :oops:
 
Sabrosura said:
https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=969857290570394

A powerful public complaint from a woman who quit (sensual) bachata about the huge issues with it in the US.

Key words: bad technique, lack of understanding of how the body and joints move, doing kung fu with the follow's body, using force to bend the follow into positions that just don't work for the human body.

This feels so validating :bookworm:
Click to expand...
Plus it's disrespectful to dominicans, I am surprised the BS crowd hasn't been cancelled yet.
 
Governor Moonbeam said:
I feel for her, and enjoyed the rant, but this stuff (to a lesser extent) has been going on for years in salsa. Especially in your "tourist" latin clubs where drunk college kids show up and grind on the dance floor and/or do cringe-worthy turn patterns.
Click to expand...

Agreed, but her main point is about BS doing actual bodily harm, for example by applying force to joints -- and bodily harm is definitely a bigger risk in BS than salsa (rough salsa leads and dangerous dippers notwithstanding).

I went to a BS night in NYC (there was nothing else going on that night) and I was scared for my upper body joints almost every dance. I am good at protecting my body from dangerous moves, so I survived, but one guy did manage to strain something in my back. The whole thing just sucks.
 
Daniel y Desirée has been doing that elbow/wrist for years now. I am surprised that she didn't know it. Daniel y Desirée are husband and wife, they dance together like forever. They make some moves to show the skill, but if you try that move on strangers, those girls should punch you in the face.

I will never try the elbow/wrist thing. I have seen people done it at social, and I got disgusted. Every time I see a guy force the girl into some sensual bachata moves, I just shake my head.

The local dance studio teaches awkward sensual bachata moves, very cheezy. Their students came to the scene like they are the masters and want to tried those moves on followers. It's sad.

Look at the video at 1:04 mark for the elbow thing.

 
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