Why do so many Cubans dance Casino on 3?

Discussion in 'Just Dance' started by khabibul35, Mar 9, 2017.

  1. khabibul35

    khabibul35 Tumbao

    I have been dancing Casino for almost 5 years now and both during my travels (from watching Cubans dance in Cuba and watching Cuban immigrants dance in various cities across the world) and from watching various youtube videos I couldn't help but notice that a large number of Cubans dance casino on 3.

    Now, before I get crucified for generalizing, I know that there's a huge number of Cubans who dance a tiempo (on 1) and there is also also a number who don't differentiate between 1-2-3/5-6-7 and just dance 1-2-3/1-2-3, which means there's also a pretty big portion of dancers who dance a tiempo (without caring if it's on 1 or on 5). This makes sense to me. What doesn't make sense to me is how this on 3 thing came about. Is there any reason for this trend? Is there a historical precedent for this development? Is there something in the music that lends it to this kind of dancing?

    I'm curious if there are people in this forum who have any experience or explanations with regards to this.
    elanimal and Dissonant Harmony like this.
  2. terence

    terence Maestro 'Descarga' Cachao

    On "3", was very common IME , with PRs .They often prep on1 , tap on 2 break on 3.. Is there a correlation ? maybe..
  3. Dissonant Harmony

    Dissonant Harmony Rhythm Deputy

    1) "The founders" do their Ruedas On3. This is enough to hint that dancing Casino On3 was "a thing".

    2) Why not? If the music makes you feel that's how you want to dance...Fortunately there are enough adaptable and flexible girls who can "truly" follow in the Cuban parties around...Most girls who do linear, however...
    Smejmoon likes this.
  4. vit

    vit El Sabroso de Conguero

    Having in mind that it's just merengue with one step being replaced with the tap, why would it matter which step you actually replace. There are no break steps anyway :)
  5. Sabrosura

    Sabrosura Maestro 'Sonero' Lavoe

    A fact of life is that many of us SFers (myself included) love to analyze music and dance things. :) We want to know all the "whys". But I think this particular issue will blunt our best analytical efforts because I believe the answer is simply: because it feels good to them to dance on that timing. :) The on3 thing is something I've thought about a lot myself, and it's not just a Cuban thing, Puerto Ricans also dance on3 a lot, and from what I've seen many other Latins as well. And the answer I have come up after all my analyzing as to why they dance on3 is: because, whether it's just for some songs or for all their dances, it feels good to them. :) Pausing in the middle of the musical sequence--on the 2, as opposed to at the end of the 4-beat sequence on the 4--gives a nice relaxed, drawn-out feel to the dance. So, that's my answer: Cubans and Puerto Ricans and other Latins dance on3 a lot because it feels good. :)
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2017
  6. Offbeat

    Offbeat Maestro 'Fania' Pacheco

    Rather we over analyze it to death! As long as someone can dance well and enjoy what they are doing, why should we (or they) care what they dance on :) Rather a good dancer on on3, on5 or whatever, than a bad dancer on on1 or on2!
    Live2dance, azana, vit and 2 others like this.
  7. Live2dance

    Live2dance Shine Officer

    I actually enjoy dancing on3 and I agree totally with what you said. It feels super relaxed. I have been dancing on3 regularly in the past 3 years but some ladies find it difficult to accept so I switch to on1 when I see discomfort. I do think that it will feel even better dancing on 7 but I need to experiment with that. By the way dancing on 3 feels more son-like to me as it allows me to do the hip action on 2. So it is not like the 3 merengue steps and tap approach.
    Sabrosura and cachondea like this.
  8. elanimal

    elanimal Nuevo Ritmo

    There are a lot of anecdotes that people in the first salsa congress in the world, held in Puerto Rico in 1997, had very different styles, ranging from dancing on1, on2, on3, and even dancing 'cruzado,' which is breaking with the right foot forward and left foot back in the basic step. My own mom, a Puerto Rican woman through and through who has lived in Rio Piedras all her life, sometimes dances cruzado.

    It's tough to determine the reason as to why certain styles were learned. It's similar to asking how languages arise. Some scientists have shown correlations between climate and language features:

    "Languages in hotter, more forested regions such as the tropics tended to be “sonorous,” employing lower frequency sounds and using fewer distinct consonants, whereas languages in colder, drier, more mountainous places were consonant-heavy..." http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2015/11/human-language-may-be-shaped-climate-and-terrain

    And within languages, some say language accents arise due to speech patterns of popular figures.

    If there's speculation when it comes to something as ubiquitous as language, dance patterns are likely a lost cause.

    The more interesting question, and one that might have an easier answer, is why certain styles came to overcome the others. Why did on1 and on2 prevail over its on3 and cruzado siblings?
    Dissonant Harmony likes this.
  9. terence

    terence Maestro 'Descarga' Cachao

    Many dance patterns, have well documented origins, and most are based upon, or around, the simple "square " , and foot positions are adapted from Ballet .

    As to timing preferences, again, one needs to look at antecedents Like Danzon, for one ex.
    Add to the "mix" the rhythm construction of " dance ", and this will often point us in a given direction.

    And the other obvious influence as to why "2". Mambo...
    And "1" would be related to Guajira .

    ALL dances in the social strata are hybrids ( with very few exceptions ) and have been influenced, from the very basic

    construction, by adapting specific elements that have

    embellished those core foundational movements.
  10. granrey

    granrey Sonero

    Breaking forward with the right foot on the next two videos;
    On3 i think.

    On2 i think

    This is another thing that I have pointed out in dominican salsa dances.

    On this one you tap side/forward on 1 with the left foot and break forward on two with left foot too.

    This is another weird one on3 but backwards.

    Since there are on1, on2 and on3 in so many variations of each. Is there on4?
  11. terence

    terence Maestro 'Descarga' Cachao

    Back in the late 40s early 50s, there were chain studios teaching on 4. Didn't last long ..
  12. I think its because a lot of latinos don't analyze music like we do. They are not listening for where the phrasing of the music begins and ends. They are basically listening to the parts of the phrase that feel strong to them. I think most of the time its because they focus on the baseline which usually feels good to grove on the 3. I teach spanish salsa lessons in Orange County and I see a lot of Mexican people do the same but only with certain songs. I tell them to stop listening to only the base and to listen to the melody which helps a little but then the next song they still do the same.
    manzanadulce and MAMBO_CEC like this.
  13. Live2dance

    Live2dance Shine Officer

    None of the examples you gave of on3 look or feel like on3 to me. The first is ... the last video is on2 ET. The on3 feels like a strong action with emphasis on the step on 1. Followed by hip action or pose and then the break.

    This is on 3 from about 1:00 onwards. I see nothing wrong in terms of musicality.
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2017
  14. Live2dance

    Live2dance Shine Officer

    Another example of on3 is the first min of this dance.
  15. terence

    terence Maestro 'Descarga' Cachao

    And what exactly, is " Spanish " salsa ?.. do you mean you teach in Spanish ?.
    Dissonant Harmony likes this.
  16. Offbeat

    Offbeat Maestro 'Fania' Pacheco

    By that still doesn't explain preference for timing in one region vs another. I don't think a region that breaks on a certain beat, thinks so much about it. My guess is that how regional preferences develop can sometimes be rationally explained and are sometimes complete irrational in a sense they can't be explained. Sometimes it can just be an accident of history like some started doing it and everyone followed.

    To seek explanation for every little nuance is a fool's errand. Couldn't be possible that sometimes it is jut not possible to know or an explanation doesn't exist! To conjure up what explanation could be for something that happened in the past can sometimes be akin to a solution looking for a problem.
    wol and timberamayor like this.
  17. granrey

    granrey Sonero

    Interesting, I'm not sure what ET means. I always thought the last video I posted was on2 but it did not make much sense to me as the breaks are hapening on bits 3 and 7.

    On2 the breaks happen on bits 2 and 6. So, I'm not sure why it would be called On2 ET, when the breaks are hapenning on bits 3 and 7?
  18. Live2dance

    Live2dance Shine Officer

    The breaks are happenning on 2 and 6 but she messes up on one occasion. ET stands for Eddie Torres.
  19. terence

    terence Maestro 'Descarga' Cachao

    Eddie Torres... the style you see, is what he teaches . The 5 is a prep step for breaking on 6 ( 1 of the 2nd bar ) .
  20. salsa lessons taught in the spanish language

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