What is an inside turn?

Discussion in 'Just Dance' started by Melvin, Sep 2, 2008.

  1. Melvin

    Melvin Tumbao

    There seems to be some confusion here.

    1. This is what I learned at class

    Let's say my follower is at North, I am South, facing follower

    Imagine a line North-South (travelling direction), whatever side of this line I am on is my side.

    If the follower while travelling rotates towards my side, it's an "Inside turn"

    Inside = My side

    2. This is what I've read at other places

    Inside turn = the follower turns left = Counter Clockwise

    The definitions don't match, obviously. A CCW turn can be both "Inside" or "Outside" depending on what side or direction follower is travelling.

    Which one is correct, most accepted?
  2. Offbeat

    Offbeat ¬°WEPA!

    The second one.
  3. irishgirl

    irishgirl Rhythm Deputy

    If the prep is on 5, it's an inside turn
    if the prep is on 3 it's an outside turn

    i hope i got that right..i've had zero sleep this weekend !
  4. devane

    devane Son Montuno

    The 2nd one.

    I actually found an useful clip on youtube without being side-tracked. ;)

    The cbl with an inside turn shown in the clip is a better alternative than a plain ol cbl/dqn. You'll see it all the time.

    I can't visualise the 1st one....

    "Which one is correct, most accepted?"
    Terminology isn't standard or universally used. So once you get past the basic moves describing moves or sequences or decoding someones descriptions becomes an artform I'm afraid.
  5. Melvin

    Melvin Tumbao

    OK, imagine the follower in the video rotating CCW on the right side of the leader. This would according to "1" make it an "Outside turn".

    Otherwise, why is it called "Inside", inside related to what?
  6. antigone

    antigone Pattern Police

    Inside and outside moves can be done on any count, I would caution against using counts as the benchmark. The clearest explanation I can offer is that inside means turning into the closed space created by the leader and follower, so the follower moves towards the leader at the beginning fo the turn. In outisde turn the follower moves away from the leader. Same deal with inside/ouside foot (easier o explain when the leader and follower are offset, as in ballroom...not always applicable in face-to-face open position salsa). Where are terrence and sweavo? They should be able to explain this easily.
  7. Melvin

    Melvin Tumbao

    This matches what I was taught at class, definition 1, and contradicts definition 2, which appears to be more popular.
  8. antigone

    antigone Pattern Police

    Def#2 (inside=counterclockwise) will apply for most basic moves. Def.1 is not contradictory, but more general, and applies to more advanced variations (in which movement can be in either direction, and direction can change int he middle of a phrase without prep steps)
  9. KP-salsa

    KP-salsa Shine Officer

    If you were leading a reverse crossbody travelling turn an "inside" turn would be clockwise, whereas if you were leading a normal crossbody travelling turn an "inside" turn would be anti-clockwise. So "inside" and "outside" are relative to the leader's position to the left or right of his partner's direction of dance.
  10. Melvin

    Melvin Tumbao

    Definition 2 is certainly contradictory to definition 1, it seems awkward to have to make an arbitrary decision if a move is "advanced" or basic when expected to do an inside turn, or if you want to explain to someone what you saw at the dancefloor.

    The point of definitions is to be able to be precise and consistent, to be able to communicate and agree on what we are talking about. Otherwise communication becomes rather pointless.
  11. devane

    devane Son Montuno

    The term "outside turn" doesn't automatically self-desribe because you must know what "outside" refers to in dance terms. I've heard many people argue about what inside or outside means to them when they first hear the terms.

    I don't give much thought into why something is called "inside" or "outside". I just map the term to the direction. I had the same problem when I did Kung-fu. You have terms like "cross-hand" and "parallel" for both hand and feet positions. A parallel hand position makes sense when you look at it, but with the feet, the name didn't make sense. I was told it was only a naming convention and as long as I could recognise it and use the term to describe it, that is all that mattered.

    I just know that from all the dvds I have and all the classes I've been to they classify "inside" this way.
  12. Melvin

    Melvin Tumbao

    Again, definition 1. OK, maybe my teacher is right, and Wikipedia is wrong.
  13. Melvin

    Melvin Tumbao

    It makes sense at dance class to use definition 1 to stressed out student leaders, it's easier for them to decide what is "My Side" = Inside when deciding which way to turn follower, rather than having them thinking about analog watches or "left for me or for her?!".

    And I think it does matter what words we use, it would make it easier to discuss these matters, and learn salsa, if there was some kind of consensus or standard terminology.
  14. Salsamakossa

    Salsamakossa Shine Officer

    Mr KP has got it right. Whether it is an inside or outside turn is relative to the position of the leader.

  15. terence

    terence Maestro 'Descarga' Cachao

  16. Melvin

    Melvin Tumbao

    I wasn't primarily looking for a simple answer, but for a correct one. By referring to your answer as "simple", do you imply there is more to it but it's not worth the effort explaining it?

    Is an inside turn always to the left according to you, no exceptions?
  17. chr

    chr Shine Officer


    It means "German" in French.
  18. terence

    terence Maestro 'Descarga' Cachao

    Simple as in what the word implies.. in otherwords, dont try to complicate the answer.. .. heres an idea.. you are driving, you have to.. make a left turn.. which way do you turn the steering wheel ?.., towards you of course .

    And by the way.. most of what I say when referencing techn. is established B/room dance techn. dating back 80 yrs ,and used by all of us in the profession when we examine , and related purposes.

    Last .. yes, ALL inside is left
  19. terence

    terence Maestro 'Descarga' Cachao

    Thats why I posted ?... should have answered in Spanish !!
  20. terence

    terence Maestro 'Descarga' Cachao

    Nothing to do with it

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