Learning from Youtube stigma..

Discussion in 'Just Dance' started by Chris_Yannick, Jul 29, 2017.

  1. Chris_Yannick

    Chris_Yannick Rhythm Deputy

    So lately, I have been noticing more and more self-righteous dance teachers abhorring learning from Youtube, saying how you should go to classes instead, don't copy others choreography, etc...

    I partially agree with this statement but at the same time i don't.

    I have personally learned a lot from watching Youtube videos of my favorite dancers and of course my favorite teachers. The point isn't to steal choreography. It is to learn more about my own body and limitations. Some of us don't have the opportunity to take classes with great teachers.

    Anyway , i don't really get it when people equate learning from Youtube to a sin.

    Isn't the point to use as many resources you can at your disposal?
     
    #1
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  2. Live2dance

    Live2dance Shine Officer

    I fully understand you. To me it all depends on the level of the dancer. If their technique level is low then they risk simply trying to immitate more advanced dancers without an understanding of the underlying dance principles. That could result in a hilarious or even dangerous situation. If on the other hand your technique level is high then youtube is a paradise!
     
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  3. nowhiteshoes

    nowhiteshoes Pattern Police

    Youtube doesnt give feedback. Not great for beginners, no problem for more advanced.
     
    Smejmoon likes this.
  4. Smejmoon

    Smejmoon El Sabroso de Conguero

    On YouTube I look at myself dancing. And I learn a lot. :D about humility.
     
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  5. Smejmoon

    Smejmoon El Sabroso de Conguero

    On a more serious note. People learn differently. If it works for you - great.
     
  6. Chris_Yannick

    Chris_Yannick Rhythm Deputy

    I agree. I am just confused why some people (mainly dance teachers and choreographers) feel the need to shame this method of learning. Maybe they just want more business for their classes or want to feel superior to all of the copycats.

    Even when I was a beginner, I was learning from Youtube as a way to supplement my learning. As a more seasoned dancer, I understand a lot more of the underlying mechanics when I watch a youtube video, and this boosts my learning considerably. Enough to get me over my next plateau.
     
  7. Live2dance

    Live2dance Shine Officer

    This is what I think too. In addition, perhaps they don't want to be judged by others.
     
  8. granrey

    granrey Son

    Even teachers use YouTube.

    In the schools, I have participated. There are usualley levels 1,2 and 3.

    Level 1 teaches you the basic and this class tends to be same every time in the same shool and somewhat similar among all salsa schools.
    Level 2 tends to differ more within the same school (if you take the class in summer, the class in fall with the same teacher will not be necessarily the same) and very different among schools as teaches tend to change things based on popularity and other things.

    Level 3 tends to be about combos.

    Why am I saying this to give my opinion? Cause there is no way that a single school will teach you all the styles, steps combos you like and many of us cannot learn by simply seeing someone else dancing in a club ONE TIME.

    In my case, 50% of my moves come from moves I learned from YouTube. Even though I have taken lots of courses, workshops, drop in classes, etc .

    The other thing is that if when you see a move you like. It's hard to explain to a teacher the move itself (since you don't know the move anyways). Even if you know one of the many names the move might have, people usually have different variations of it. For instance:" cross body lead 180" or "cross body lead 360". These names means something different to many people.


    Also learning from YouTube is not copying, the odds are those people copied or learned from someone else. There is no that much originality in salsa.
     
    Chris_Yannick likes this.
  9. Jag75

    Jag75 Shine Officer

    As a teacher - I don't think learning from YouTube at the *beginning* is a good idea. Most people will rapidly develop bad habits when doing this, and will try to learn beyond what they should be learning when they aren't ready to be learning the more advanced stuff.

    Having said that it's a great tool if you're a more experienced dancer and have strong fundamentals. I watch YouTube a lot and learn a lot from it, but I also have a regular coach who I consider one of the top dancers in Australia to keep me from developing bad habits.
     
    Chris_Yannick likes this.
  10. terence

    terence Maestro 'Descarga' Cachao

    1st Para. That's exactly the reason why not..

    2nd.. Props to you !!

    Video learning/instruction cannot teach nuance and usually ( from the little I have seen ) good technique if any .

    This also begs the question; If one attempts to learn more advanced work from vids, is it done with a partner ?. My guess is probably not .
     
  11. terence

    terence Maestro 'Descarga' Cachao

    Under guidance .
     
  12. Offbeat

    Offbeat El Sabroso de Conguero

    On an extreme that is like asking why learning to fly a plane or drive a car via online learning is a bad advice :) I am sure the pilots via learning from simulations also have to fly real airplanes to get their license.

    As others have noted if you are beginner and don't have your understanding and mastery of the fundamentals down, you are going to cause more harm than good. There are good teachers and bad teachers. But it is bad to jump and ascribe the 'business' as a motivation for them cautioning people to learn from youtube. If I were to put myself in a teacher's shoes, it would be headache for me to correct something that a student learnt on youtube.

    One thing youtube doesn't give you is feedback on what you are doing correct vs incorrect. Inspite of dancing with dancers who have been taken lessons for one or two years, I find many of them having weak technique (compared to the number of classes they take). Youtube is not going to fix that.

    Where youtube is good is giving you exposure to different ideas and elements that you can incorporate in your dancing. It is not going to fix things like your grounding, cuban motion, etc.

    Learning is always better and faster under guidance.
     
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  13. elanimal

    elanimal Tumbao

    There are many details that don't exist in youtube videos. Specifically, subtleties of leading. For example, how much 'force' is necessary when leading anything, a turn, copa, cross body, etc. Stepping small. Turn out of the feet. Hand and wrist rotations to facilitate constant inside-finger connection. etc etc.

    There are so, so many details to correct in any dancer below intermediate that when they focus on things taught in youtube videos, whether actual formally taught or just social dancing videos, they will lead things without a lot of those details.

    When the veil is lifted from the eyes of beginners that they begin to see the granular details of leading, they can start looking at youtube videos and deconstructing them carefully.
     
  14. Chris_Yannick

    Chris_Yannick Rhythm Deputy

    I would not discourage beginners from watching youtube, especially if it means they become more motivated to learn.

    Everyone i know who learn from Youtube regularly are better dancers than those who don't. I believe the intrinsic motivation makes them better and not necessarily the instruction, which for the most part, is subpar.
     
  15. vit

    vit Clave Commander

    Well, that said .... these things are hard to pick even on regular classes with more than 5-6 couples, where teacher doesn't have time to walk around and dance with people. Not to mention congress classes with hundreds ... Really useful are privates and small classes where there is some in-person correction/feedback. Usability of everything else is quite limited.
     
    G809 likes this.
  16. Offbeat

    Offbeat El Sabroso de Conguero

    I am not sure if that is accurate. As an onlooker, I can pick many things in a group class that people are doing incorrectly. I wonder why instructor can't? Are they being lazy? Some good instructors will usually pick on what one or two people may be doing wrong and immediately address it without pointing out to anyone in particular. I have also seen instructors who go around pulling people out and correcting them, when they put on a song for people to dance to.

    Agreed, this may not be possible if there are hundred couples, but it is certainly possible if there are 10 to 15 couple. Most beginners make similar mistakes. If I were teaching a class there are somethings I would point right away for people to think of for improving their dancing in future. One class can't fix much. But instructors can certain provide pointers on what can be improved. That is the art of teaching. I don't see most instructors adding any value beyond asking students to reproduce the sequence/move they are teaching for that moment. It is also one reason, I am very selective about whose workshop or class I will take.
     
  17. vit

    vit Clave Commander

    Yeah, but then all classes including youtube clips can be good because most people watching particular clip belong to similar level corresponding to that clip and therefore are supposedly making similar mistakes ... ;)
     
  18. terence

    terence Maestro 'Descarga' Cachao

    o_O :eek:.. IF you are trained by a BR Latin dancer..
     
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  19. Live2dance

    Live2dance Shine Officer

    :D
     
  20. vit

    vit Clave Commander

    Maybe it was about turn type
     

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