When Not To Ask A Person To Dance?

Recently at a local Congress I saw a guy I know say something to a local female. Her reaction was adamant as she waved her hands in the air and briskly walked away from him. He then followed her and began talking to her and she seemed upset in further explaining what was bothering her.

I did not hear this conversation, but I think I know what was going on because I know the people involved. These two people see each other on a weekly basis and dance at local clubs. This was a Salsa Congress and she wanted to dance with new people, particularly the out-of-town stars and instructors. This may have even been the second time he asked her to dance that night. The guy is a decent dancer, but she got pissed because this is her opportunity to dance with new guys and the local guy is taking up valuable time.

Do you have a rule about dancing with the locals you see on a weekly basis at major salsa events? For instance, my friend has a rule that if he travels out of town to a major event he doesn't dance with the people he sees back home on a weekly basis. His theory is ... "I didn't fly 7,000 miles to dance with someone I will see 4 days from now and dance with at the local club."

Perhaps its easier for guys since we do the asking? In a new scene, a female might not get asked if guys don't know her and there are many known choices. In any event, there are probably some local folks that might get turned off if you don't dance with them when out-of-town and vise-versa. Is there a "rule of thumb" you follow?

AguaDulce said:

Do you have a rule about dancing with the locals you see on a weekly basis at major salsa events? For instance, my friend has a rule that if he travels out of town to a major event he doesn't dance with the people he sees back home on a weekly basis. His theory is ... "I didn't fly 7,000 miles to dance with someone I will see 4 days from now and dance with at the local club."

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I don't have a fixed rule to completely avoid dancing with locals. My guideline is to spend my time dancing with all those people that I don't usually see/meet at some event. But if a local follow would ask me for a dance, I surely wouldn't refuse her and add one dance with her. I would also tell her about my stance and that she should rather use the opportunity to dance with all the other leads and gain new experience. If that behaviour is really going to turn her off, then it's a problem with her expectations and attitude and not something that I would care about much.

I have such a rule. I broke it this year at the LA congress because too many of my random shots were misses. But where there's ample new and talented blood? Stay away... o' stepchildren of my local scene!! (Unless you happen to be one of my all time favorites, then I'd likely still ask such a local )

As to the subject line of the thread though... don't ask me to dance when I'm laying down. Like really though. I'm sprawled across 4/5 chairs on the side of dance floor, dog tired, completely limp, slightly intoxicated, in no condition to dance.... dont ask me to.

ETA: hypothetically speaking of course. id never lay myself out from a "dance" stupor in public. :tongue:

Sometimes, I just go into autopilot and ask whoever is around. I asked a girl to dance the other night that was on a cellphone. I don't know what I was thinking.

"I didn't fly 7,000 miles to dance with someone I will see 4 days from now and dance with at the local club."

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I think that's pretty understandable and there's nothing wrong with it, but it depends on how it is done and explained. No matter what, it doesn't give anyone an opportunity to be rude about it.

I have a friend that I dance/practice with pretty often. At the big socials, we'll try to find each other about once an hour. I'm not sure why, but since we're not advanced dancers, yet surrounded by advance dancers, there is some sort of comfort we both derive from dancing with each other and knowing that neither of us is putting each other under a microscope. Maybe there's a limit to that, but I think since we have gone through the learning process together for so long, I don't think either of us will ever say no to each other.

I used to have that rule at salsa congresses. It was more relevant when I lived in Chicago and went to the Chicago congress. Now that I'm in MSP I have relaxed the rule a little especially if the band is doing an absolutely awesome song that I just have get the right partner for and I don't want to take a chance on someone I don't know for the next 20 minutes.

Add: as I meet up with other people from the midwest whom I only see every year at the Chi congress I actually find myself socializing (!) more while dancing at the congress.

If the two in the story dance together around their home venues, then it's a bit sad if one won't give the other one dance at a Congress (two might be pushing it) but all these situations can be handled by applying the usual rules and courtesies.

She turned him down - he shouldn't have asked again, until she asked him, even if it took until the weeks following the congress. It is easier all round if people follow these principles. There's plenty more partners to have fun with meanwhile. Stay loose.

I used to go to Congresses & there was one time I came across a favourite partner I hadn't seen for two years since she went abroad and we danced till our legs fell off. Haven't seen her since, either, come to think of it. Pity!

chrisk said:

I don't have a fixed rule to completely avoid dancing with locals. My guideline is to spend my time dancing with all those people that I don't usually see/meet at some event. But if a local follow would ask me for a dance, I surely wouldn't refuse her and add one dance with her. I would also tell her about my stance and that she should rather use the opportunity to dance with all the other leads and gain new experience. If that behaviour is really going to turn her off, then it's a problem with her expectations and attitude and not something that I would care about much.

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Great answer!

Same. Man, i worried about this idea when I first went out but realised man I stay out that I can dance with a lot of people he he


That said, assuming limited dancing opportunities I still think it is a balance. Eg.

If you go and dance with all the new people, then you have to go home sometime and if you spite your local scene, guess who will not be getting dances or getting attitude for 80% of the year...

If you go and dance with your local scene, well thats an expensive night out

So I try and explain my intentions before to the local scene and during if it comes up. Have at least 1 dance with the locals and hopefully more.

*lesson learnt after I had the feedback that people thought I preferred the outside scene more than my own and said why don't you move there...

*actually felt more appreciated outside my scene at the time, but have realised I was not giving myself completely here locally and the more i gave myself locally, the more I have been sought after/acknowledge and appreciated

Generally my rule is . . .
1 dance for local friends, if the night is a rough one for either of us and we are close friends, maybe 2. Also there is the one dance per better dancer per night. Those are congress rules as far as I am concerned. One of my friends and I created these rules together seeing as we danced together very often in our local scene. She used to complain often to me about locals asking her to dance often at congresses.

As you start traveling more you start to make "congress friends" people who you only see at congresses. They can get two per night.

In general I say, always leave them wanting more.

Brownskin818 said:

I have such a rule. I broke it this year at the LA congress because too many of my random shots were misses. But where there's ample new and talented blood? Stay away... o' stepchildren of my local scene!! (Unless you happen to be one of my all time favorites, then I'd likely still ask such a local )

As to the subject line of the thread though... don't ask me to dance when I'm laying down. Like really though. I'm sprawled across 4/5 chairs on the side of dance floor, dog tired, completely limp, slightly intoxicated, in no condition to dance.... dont ask me to.

ETA: hypothetically speaking of course. id never lay myself out from a "dance" stupor in public. :tongue:

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I will ask someone who is cool and looks good to dance anytime he he. BUT say I see imaginary Brownskin818 lying down (assuming conscious), I will make a joke of it and ask for a dance when you can stand again. Then make sure we find each other later or another time

opm1s6 said:

but since we're not advanced dancers,

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Man, reading your posts and it sounds like you have grasped some massively advanced concepts so keep working hard at the technical side and looking forward to your post where you say 'as an advanced dancer'

Wow, that is such an accomplishment to be able to say that.

I look forward to working hard and being strong for my journey so oneday I can share that too!

vin said:

Generally my rule is . . .
1 dance for local friends, if the night is a rough one for either of us and we are close friends, maybe 2. Also there is the one dance per better dancer per night. Those are congress rules as far as I am concerned. One of my friends and I created these rules together seeing as we danced together very often in our local scene. She used to complain often to me about locals asking her to dance often at congresses.

As you start traveling more you start to make "congress friends" people who you only see at congresses. They can get two per night.

In general I say, always leave them wanting more.

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LOL, nice

*imagines VIN saying: The first rule of Congress club is.....................

You don't talk about the congress club

wow, guys, never really thought about congress specific rules before. i guess my approach, regardless of whether its a congress or not, is to dance with new people. i don't seek out my "favourites" if there's a chance to dance with someone new.

in general, as far as not asking someone to dance, i sometimes use eye contact. if they smile, then certainly yes, if they give no response, i'll still ask. if they turn around or give some other unfavourable response, i'll obviously not ask...of course if she's on my blacklist, i won't dance with her at all.

at a congress, i'm certainly hoping to dance with new partners. but i'll assume that dancers from my local scene are there with the same intention. And if someone from my home scene still asks me to dance, it could potentially mean that they are having a bad time etc. - i wouldn't have a problem saying yes to them - even 2-3 times in an evening. again - this depends on who that person is from my home scene. if it is a very well known salsa pal/buddy, then i'll be more accomodative than if it is someone who is just a known face but not really someone i know well.


of course, this would be a problem if i can't get my own dancing fix and be able to dance with others in the congress. hopefully, such a worst case scenario won't occur - but if it does, i might have to politely decline some inivitations.

My congress rules:
- I don't *ask* any guys I dance with regularly in my local scene. If they ask me, I accept.

- I actively seek and ask guys I know from other congresses/city visits, i.e., guys I know but don't have a chance to dance with regularly.

- I try and get at least one dance with any SFers/DFers attending the event

- I also ask random strangers - usually guys I've seen dance with other girls and look like fun to dance with. If none of them is available, but still want to dance, I just ask the nearest guy standing.

- I might also ask performers/superstars if I'm in that kind of mood :roll:

- Anyone who asks me gets a yes. The only exception is when the guy keeps coming back to me and I want to dance with others, in which case he gets a "dance again later" reply.

- I don't usually ask the same guy twice at the same congress unless I feel that both of us really enjoyed the first dance. If someone I danced with asks me the following night, I'm quite happy to accept, except:

- If anyone turns out to be an arm wrencher/groper/wannabe teacher, I try and avoid him :?

I've never made up formal rules for congresses but thinking about how I chose my dance partners in previous congresses they're something like this:

- I dance with anyone who asks

- I seek out friends I don't get to see often

- I ask anybody who stands near me and looks like he'd like to dance

- and for coming congresses: I'll hopefully take up the courage to ask instructors/performers

Isn't it ironic that the biggest proponents of spontanous dancing, fun, musicality, etc are the ones who come up with pathetic rules? 1 dance / night! why? is their a limit? a proper ratio? what about if you want more? or if the guy really wants a second dance with you 4 hours later? Like some girl I met, I told her to dance with a guy friend, great lead, she says 'yes, but we already danced once'. So what?! Let things come to you and be generous instead of making all those rules that create tension and misunderstandings rather than stimulate spontanious behavior.

Casey said:

Isn't it ironic that the biggest proponents of spontanous dancing, fun, musicality, etc are the ones who come up with pathetic rules? 1 dance / night! why? is their a limit? a proper ratio? what about if you want more? or if the guy really wants a second dance with you 4 hours later? Like some girl I met, I told her to dance with a guy friend, great lead, she says 'yes, but we already danced once'. So what?! Let things come to you and be generous instead of making all those rules that create tension and misunderstandings rather than stimulate spontanious behavior.

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Lol, I hope you feel better for that! Personally I don't have a rule. I'll gladly dance with my local buddies. For me Salsa's not about a ranking system, and partly this willingness not to chase the superstars is a reaction to some pressure that had been put on me to "better" myself and do just that.

I've usually been so hyper on the party nights that I don't get to see most locals let alone give them time to ask for a dance!

I DID one time get exceedingly grumpy when a beginner pretended to know me to get a dance and the connection was a compLETE failure. But I had gone over to the Dark Side that night :-( That was the bit for me where Luke Skywalker gets his hand chopped off in the Empire Stirkes Back. I will never allow myself to get back in that state of mind.

Casey said:

Isn't it ironic that the biggest proponents of spontanous dancing, fun, musicality, etc are the ones who come up with pathetic rules? 1 dance / night! why? is their a limit? a proper ratio? what about if you want more? or if the guy really wants a second dance with you 4 hours later?

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I don't see any irony in my guideline or any other for congress situations. Just because you're proponing the inclusion of musicality in your dance or being spontaneous, doesn't mean in my understanding, that you're allowed to have any rules at all. I see those rules rather as guidelines, that I and others are using to have a great experience and make the trip worth it. Why would you travel to a congress and then just dance with your local friends or limit yourself to dance with a very small number of follow as they are asking you so often you can't really look out for others?

And since you also asked about the limit. Well, I use the rule of one dance per local follow, since I get to dance with my local follows nearly every week. But I won't see all those other follows on any regular basis. So I prefer to spend the time at the congress in dancing with all those other follows and make some new experience (and maybe new friends). And just think about the number of follows at any congress and the limited number of hours that you've got at party to dance with them. If you want to dance with a lot of them, you'll need to put in some limit of dances per person. And let's not forget that while we talk here about rules (or as I like to call them guidelines), I doubt that have been engraved in stone. So there's always room for exceptions and I guess most of us will use them when the dance with somebody was really great.

Casey said:

Isn't it ironic that the biggest proponents of spontanous dancing, fun, musicality, etc are the ones who come up with pathetic rules? 1 dance / night! why? is their a limit? a proper ratio? what about if you want more? or if the guy really wants a second dance with you 4 hours later? Like some girl I met, I told her to dance with a guy friend, great lead, she says 'yes, but we already danced once'. So what?! Let things come to you and be generous instead of making all those rules that create tension and misunderstandings rather than stimulate spontanious behavior.

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I'm sure people who have these rules or strategies have them for a reason, which may or may not be pathetic. Maybe they'd rather dance with a lot of different people and they only stay out for 2 hours or so. Maybe they want to keep things "fresh" with certain people by not dancing with them too much in a short period of time. Whatever the motive, I'm sure it suits their personal needs/desires, and I don't think any of us should be criticizing it.

I've only been to one Congress, but I remember not worrying about dancing with locals along with new people simply because there was so much time to be spent dancing. So what if I have a few dances with locals? There's still plenty of time to dance with others as well. That's just me though; I'm sure others wanted to maximize the number of new dances. Also, a friend of mine and veteran of many Congresses actually expressed to me that she likes dancing with people she knows at Congresses because she got tired of guys getting all crazy with her when they realized how good she was. With the locals, she knew what to expect and who she could go to for good dances. To each his/her own, I guess.