5 Top Salseros/Divas

[salcero2005]

So who are the top 5 salseros? How about salsa divas? :lol:

Salseros: Frankie Martinez, Juan Matos, Milton Cobo, Oliver Pineda, Franklin Diaz.

Divas - Edie the salsa freak, Griselle Ponce, Nancy Ortiz, Jorget, Duplessy Walker.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Honerable Mention:

Salseros - Seon "the stylist", Cristian Oviedo, Super Mario, Mario B, Joel, Al "Liquid" Silver

Salseras - Amanda Estilo, Liz Lira, Magna, Irene Otero, Burju

[Miami Rueda dancer]

from SF Miami Rueda Dancer for sure... something about him in his style ;)

[salcero2005]

from SF Miami Rueda Dancer for sure... something about him in his style ;)

I don't think Rueda gets as much credit as it should. I got some tapes from Cuba and the moves are outstanding. Here in the USA, 80% of the moves I was shown end in Sombrero? :eyebrow:

[pr]

Al Quick Silver
I think it should be Al "Liquid Silver" Espinoza. ;)

[salcero2005]

Al Quick Silver
I think it should be Al "Liquid Silver" Espinoza. ;)

You're right!!! At this point, I think if you said just Al people would know. :lol:

[irMaxSALSA]

My top five salseros are...

1. Eddie Torres
2. Eddie Torres
3. Eddie Torres
4. Eddie Torres
5. and last but not least: Eddie Torres

My top five salsa divas are...

1. Maria Torres
2. Maria Torres
3. Maria Torres
4. Maria Torres
5. Nadia Torres

And there you have it! Let's not forget the Man with the Master Plan. Mr. ET himself can put anybody in a reality check. He is also history in the making... Don't forget to look him up in the book Cuban Fire. It's under the review section.

[salcero2005]

My top five salseros are...

1. Eddie Torres
2. Eddie Torres
3. Eddie Torres
4. Eddie Torres
5. and last but not least: Eddie Torres

My top five salsa divas are...

1. Maria Torres
2. Maria Torres
3. Maria Torres
4. Maria Torres
5. Nadia Torres

And there you have it! Let's not forget the Man with the Master Plan. Mr. ET himself can put anybody in a reality check. He is also history in the making... Don't forget to look him up in the book Cuban Fire. It's under the review section.

Why ET? I like Maria, but a salsa diva? Can you explain?

[irMaxSALSA]

Have you ever seen them dance?

I mean...

I tried to help demonstrate a cool turn pattern in Maria's class and she makes me shake in the knees. She has a huge stylish presence, it's quite intimidating. I'm a pretty confident guy with 5 years of "On 2" dancing under my belt and she made me feel like a beginner again, but I'm sure she didn't mean it.

As for Eddie Torres...

He lights up the room and NEVER forgets a face. He puts the SHINE in OPEN SHINE and the WORK in partner work. My wife and I religiously attended the Intermediate/Advance Sunday class for two years straight and he did not repeat a move. Each partner move was as unique as a human fingerprint. It was on the 106th class that he actually repeated part of a turn pattern that occured on the 30th class. *I kept a personal dance diary of all the moves he taught. Now it's a video library.

On a personal level I'm trying to crack the Eddie Torres code--similar to cracking the code in the matrix. <---Stupid analogy...but I'm sure you'll understand if you're a sci-fi fan. When ET approaches a class turn pattern he breaks the predictable approach and creates a facade of impossible leads and unorthodox movements. He doesn't let the music move him, he moves in the music with control and style.

His principal dancers, and these guys can JAM their asses off, still buckle at their feet because every movement he teaches breaks their usual "comfort move" coordination to salsa dancing.

He creates magical hand switches that baffle the best copycats. He creates turns patterns that will challenge the creative integrity of the best leaders and followers in the world.

In my opinion, it's very difficult for me to name anybody because they fail to come across to me with anything spectacular. Alot of the guys and couples I've seen dancing online look sooooooo smooth that it becomes overkill and then it becomes the equivalent of two people riding the Walt Disney Teacup amusement ride. With the exception of Alex DaSilva--he got some killer follower aerials, holds, pretzel turns, etc., and some of the couples dancing on the Mayan Competition Website--the leaders in some of those videos actually PERFORM with their follower. They are actually stepping with the beat and some of those performers don't "mush" their steps.

It's a shame that Eddie Torres didn't continue his On2 Online service. It was a plain website with killer moves for beginner thru advanced.

[memphis salsero]

Maybe not the best, but who are my favorites!

1. Fernando Sosa
2. Francisco Vasquez
3. Johnny Vasquez
4. Juan Matos
5. Orvil Small

1. Edie Espinoza
2. Burju
3. Liz Lira
4. Tamarra (as in Tito and Tamarra)
5. Joby Brava

[memphis salsero]

Ok at the club I went to tonight they had two big screens that had salsa videos rolling. The main one was one from Henry Herrera. OH MY!! That guy can move, I've never seen a dancer with so much energy. So I think he is my favorite dancer for this month. I can not wait to see he and Edie perform. Honestly, in his style is there anyone who can match him?

[salcero2005]

Have you ever seen them dance?

I mean...

I tried to help demonstrate a cool turn pattern in Maria's class and she makes me shake in the knees. She has a huge stylish presence, it's quite intimidating. I'm a pretty confident guy with 5 years of "On 2" dancing under my belt and she made me feel like a beginner again, but I'm sure she didn't mean it.

As for Eddie Torres...

He lights up the room and NEVER forgets a face. He puts the SHINE in OPEN SHINE and the WORK in partner work. My wife and I religiously attended the Intermediate/Advance Sunday class for two years straight and he did not repeat a move. Each partner move was as unique as a human fingerprint. It was on the 106th class that he actually repeated part of a turn pattern that occured on the 30th class. *I kept a personal dance diary of all the moves he taught. Now it's a video library.

On a personal level I'm trying to crack the Eddie Torres code--similar to cracking the code in the matrix. <---Stupid analogy...but I'm sure you'll understand if you're a sci-fi fan. When ET approaches a class turn pattern he breaks the predictable approach and creates a facade of impossible leads and unorthodox movements. He doesn't let the music move him, he moves in the music with control and style.

His principal dancers, and these guys can JAM their asses off, still buckle at their feet because every movement he teaches breaks their usual "comfort move" coordination to salsa dancing.

He creates magical hand switches that baffle the best copycats. He creates turns patterns that will challenge the creative integrity of the best leaders and followers in the world.

In my opinion, it's very difficult for me to name anybody because they fail to come across to me with anything spectacular. Alot of the guys and couples I've seen dancing online look sooooooo smooth that it becomes overkill and then it becomes the equivalent of two people riding the Walt Disney Teacup amusement ride. With the exception of Alex DaSilva--he got some killer follower aerials, holds, pretzel turns, etc., and some of the couples dancing on the Mayan Competition Website--the leaders in some of those videos actually PERFORM with their follower. They are actually stepping with the beat and some of those performers don't "mush" their steps.

It's a shame that Eddie Torres didn't continue his On2 Online service. It was a plain website with killer moves for beginner thru advanced.

I didn't know ET let you video tape his classes :shock: If so, I'll have to bring the camera next time :D

[Salsera-Danij]

Salseros
1. Johnny Vazquez
2. Fernando Sosa
3. Al Liquid Silver
Those are my top

Divas
1. Vanda
2. Edie TSF
Those two stick out for me...

[Tony_salvi]

Salseros

1. Milton Cobo
2. Shaka Brown
3. Eddie Torres
4. Juan Calderon
5. Frankie Martinez

Salseras

1. Edie the salsa freak
2. Magna Gopal

[salcero2005]

So who are the top 5 salseros? How about salsa divas? :shock:

For Salseros I would think maybe Frankie Martinez, Juan Matos, Milton Cobo, Gabriel Parez, Eddie Torres.


Divas - Edie the salsa freak, Griselle Ponce, Burju, Magna, Yahaira (Santo Rico)

I'm sticking with my picks from way back :D

[LARA7799]

Salseras:

1. Maria Torres
2. Amaryllis Cintron (Santo Rico)
3. Yesenia Peralta
4. Amanda Estilo

Salseros:

1. Thomas Guerrero
2. Eddie Torres
3. Milton Cobo
4. Franklyn Diaz (ET, NY)

[David_on2]

5. Shaka Brown, smooooth lead
4. Juan Matos, he has a strong presence & charisma.
3. Milton Cobo, the best social dancer imo.
2. Eddie Torres, the master
1. Frankie Martinez

Salseras

5. Edie
4. Olivia Dasso
3. Yesenia
2. Griselle
1. Magna Gopal

[nina1salsera]

My top 5 Salseros:
Alex Dasilva.
Jhony Bravo.
Francisco Vasquez.
Jose Hagevoort.
Al Espinoza.

and for my salsa DIVASSSSS:
Jennifer Silva.
Edie the salsa freak.
Angie Quiroz.
Magna.
Susana Montero.
And jose hagevoort and angie quiroz are the best couple i had ever seen in my view of course ;)

[salsera_alemana]

Salseros:
1. Felipe Polanco
2. Tito Ortos
3. Jhesus Aponte
4. Oliver Pineda

Salseras:
Tamara (Tito Ortos' Tamara)
Does anybody know if she has any instructional videos? She has the style that I am looking for.

Chacha:
Stacey Lopez!

[armand]

Salseros:
Francisco Vasquez
Milton Cobo
Al Liquid Silver
Oliver Pineda
Fernando Sosa
Frankie Martinez

Salseras:
Burju
Liz Lira
Griselle Ponce
Emily

[chrisk]

Currently I would name the following, but that might change:

Salseros:
1. Johnny Vasquez
2. Victor (HYM)
3. Oliver Pineda

Salseras:
1. Magna
2. Edie (Salsa Freak)
3. Burju

[Blaxican]

Salseras
1.Jorjet Alcocer
2. Yesenia Peralta
3. Grisselle
4.Burju of HYM
5.Edie TSF

Salseros
1.Victor of HYM
2. Thomas of Santo Rico
3.Gordon Neal
4.Al Espinoza
5. Franciso Vasquez

[afser226]

I don't have 5, but Troy and Jorjet are great dancers and they are funny!
And if you happen to be visiting indianapolis, look out for Roberto for his super smooth dances, both on1/on2, merengue y bachata.

[salcero2005]

I don't have 5, but Troy and Jorjet are great dancers and they are funny!
And if you happen to be visiting indianapolis, look out for Roberto for his super smooth dances, both on1/on2, merengue y bachata.

I got mad respect for Troy and Jorget. Both of them are down to earth and creative dancers.

[AguaDulce]

This is tuff to pick just 5 of each. How are we judging them?

[AguaDulce]

Have you ever seen them dance?

I mean...

I tried to help demonstrate a cool turn pattern in Maria's class and she makes me shake in the knees. She has a huge stylish presence, it's quite intimidating. I'm a pretty confident guy with 5 years of "On 2" dancing under my belt and she made me feel like a beginner again, but I'm sure she didn't mean it.

As for Eddie Torres...

He lights up the room and NEVER forgets a face. He puts the SHINE in OPEN SHINE and the WORK in partner work. My wife and I religiously attended the Intermediate/Advance Sunday class for two years straight and he did not repeat a move. Each partner move was as unique as a human fingerprint. It was on the 106th class that he actually repeated part of a turn pattern that occured on the 30th class. *I kept a personal dance diary of all the moves he taught. Now it's a video library.

On a personal level I'm trying to crack the Eddie Torres code--similar to cracking the code in the matrix. <---Stupid analogy...but I'm sure you'll understand if you're a sci-fi fan. When ET approaches a class turn pattern he breaks the predictable approach and creates a facade of impossible leads and unorthodox movements. He doesn't let the music move him, he moves in the music with control and style.

His principal dancers, and these guys can JAM their asses off, still buckle at their feet because every movement he teaches breaks their usual "comfort move" coordination to salsa dancing.

He creates magical hand switches that baffle the best copycats. He creates turns patterns that will challenge the creative integrity of the best leaders and followers in the world.

In my opinion, it's very difficult for me to name anybody because they fail to come across to me with anything spectacular. Alot of the guys and couples I've seen dancing online look sooooooo smooth that it becomes overkill and then it becomes the equivalent of two people riding the Walt Disney Teacup amusement ride. With the exception of Alex DaSilva--he got some killer follower aerials, holds, pretzel turns, etc., and some of the couples dancing on the Mayan Competition Website--the leaders in some of those videos actually PERFORM with their follower. They are actually stepping with the beat and some of those performers don't "mush" their steps.

It's a shame that Eddie Torres didn't continue his On2 Online service. It was a plain website with killer moves for beginner thru advanced.

I have to agree with you. There is a lot more on Youtube now with Eddie Torres. The man is truely the King.

[claws]

So who are the top 5 salseros? How about salsa divas? :lol:

Salseros: Frankie Martinez, Juan Matos, Milton Cobo, Oliver Pineda, Franklin Diaz.

Divas - Edie the salsa freak, Griselle Ponce, Nancy Ortiz, Jorget, Duplessy Walker.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Honerable Mention:

Salseros - Seon "the stylist", Cristian Oviedo, Super Mario, Mario B, Joel, Al "Liquid" Silver

Salseras - Amanda Estilo, Liz Lira, Magna, Irene Otero, Burju

Sorry!!! I'm newbie to salsa world. I don't know the meaning of terms "Salseros" , "Divas", "Salseras".

I don't know if I'm right/wrong. But I feel

Salseros = Male salsa dancers.
Salseras = female salsa dancers.
Divas = couldn't understand :(

[MacMoto]

Divas = couldn't understand :(

According to Wiktionary:

Diva:
1. prima donna, the principal female singer of an opera company, or opera star.
2. A principal female in some other field, e.g. a prima ballerina.
3. Any female celebrity, usually a well known pop singer.
4. A person who considers herself (or by extension himself) much more important than others, has high expectations of others and becomes angry when their standards or demands are not met.
[From Italian diva (“diva, goddess”), from Latin diva (“goddess”), female of divus (“divine, divine one”)]

So salsa divas = salsa goddesses = top salseras ;)

[bolivicano]

hmmm this is a toughy. well heres my list

Salseros:
1. Oliver Pineda
2. Jayson Molina
3. Tito Ortos
4. Juan Matos
5. Al "Liquis Silver" Espinoza

Salseras:
1. Magna Gopal
2. Griselle Ponce
3. Edie TSF
4. Ana Massicot
5. Karel Flores

[Katya]

Here is my Top Salseras and salseros...

Salseras:

Erell (U-Tribe)
Susana Montera
Tamara (Tito and Tamara)
Burju (HYM)
Alexia (Latin Black)
Olga Loginova (Latin+Jazz)
...

Salseros:

Mike (U-Tribe)
Victor (HYM)
Tito (Tito and Tamara)
Seo Fernandez (Latin Black)
Aleksey Aleksentsev (Svoya Shkola)
Swing Guys
...

[shennon031]

Here is my Top Salseras and salseros...

Salseras:

Erell (U-Tribe)
Susana Montera
Tamara (Tito and Tamara)
Burju (HYM)
Alexia (Latin Black)
Olga Loginova (Latin+Jazz)
...

Salseros:

Mike (U-Tribe)
Victor (HYM)
Tito (Tito and Tamara)
Seo Fernandez (Latin Black)
Aleksey Aleksentsev (Svoya Shkola)
Swing Guys
...

Hi Katya,

My Top Salseras are the same as yours... :together:

[rckymar10]

i'm from los angeles but i am slowly making my way to the other side of the fence. here are my top 5

mine are:
1 magna gopal (NJ) - her musicality and balance of street/classical always make her a pleasure to watch, especially when she spins. she makes dancing look fun and inspires others to do so!

2 burju hurturk (BS) - love how 'out of the box' the HYM style is, she always seems to have so much time to execute her moves. she is one of the reasons me, an LA salsero, is inspired to learn on2.

3 jayson molina (NY) - a great example of less complicated 'rope tricks' and more fun leadable patterns. i enjoy his workshops more than eddie torres' and santo rico's. always a ball to watch as he is such a fireball on the floor. one of my favorite quotes from his workshops when instructing how to spin a girl, 'stir, not like soup, but like tea'

4 cristian oviedo (LA) - i always felt cristian was the best social salsero in LA as his intensity and isolations are unmatched. but he never seems to do well in competitions. i think he came in 3rd in the 2008 mayan and did not even qualify for the ESPN 2008 WSC. some opinions are that he needs a partner to better compliment his style or one that can outshine him as he is a very flamboyant dancer. and the saying normally goes, the girl should be the painting and the guy is the frame.

5 alien ramirez (LA) - not a big big name like the above, but those in the LA circuit salivate when watching her. i love her creativity, flexibility and gracefulness on the floor. an exceptional follower as i think her compact body type enhances the stock of her male counterpart [because not everybody can be 6'2" 200lbs and bench press 400lbs]. got to love her signature fringe skirt to show off her bottom assets.

almost makes my list
felicia june - a hidden gem in the LA scene. makes everything look so easy and comes out of their spins soooo effortlessly. anybody who can spin with their head tilted always earns points with me

[AguaDulce]

Someone needs to develop an objective ranking criteria. Then I would like to see a video that demostrates the completeness of a dancer on your list. Many dancers are strong in certain areas, but how many are complete?

[Blaxican]

Salseras
1.Jorjet Alcocer
2. Yesenia Peralta
3. Grisselle
4.Burju of HYM
5.Edie TSF

Salseros
1.Victor of HYM
2. Thomas of Santo Rico
3.Gordon Neal
4.Al Espinoza
5. Franciso Vasquez
After further review.....
I would like to replace Edie The Salsa Freak with a lady who I consider a Ferrari of a Dancer: Azucena Perez from Jazzy Dance Co. Best personality, style, and elegance.

Replace Francisco Vasquez with Jayson Molina. Consumate showman, great teacher, and driven professional.

[babybarbarella]

Salseras:

1.Magna (total dance package)
2.Tamara (such class)
3.Emily (ridiculous spins, this girl!!)
4.Burju (so unique)
5.Jorjet (excellent follow, great style and leads, too)

Salseros

1.Adolfo Indacochea (He is the ultimate in style)
2.Andres Giraldo
3.Milton Cobo
4.Juan Matos
5.Frankie Martinez

[AguaDulce]

Salseras:

1.Magna (total dance package)
2.Tamara (such class)
3.Emily (ridiculous spins, this girl!!)
4.Burju (so unique)
5.Jorjet (excellent follow, great style and leads, too)

Salseros

1.Adolfo Indacochea (He is the ultimate in style)
2.Andres Giraldo
3.Milton Cobo
4.Juan Matos
5.Frankie Martinez

Not a bad list. I might take out Tamara, Andres, and Milton.

[AguaDulce]

After further review.....
I would like to replace Edie The Salsa Freak with a lady who I consider a Ferrari of a Dancer: Azucena Perez from Jazzy Dance Co. Best personality, style, and elegance.

Replace Francisco Vasquez with Jayson Molina. Consumate showman, great teacher, and driven professional.

I would exclude Edie also.

[Brownskin818]

Hmmmm.... not sure I've ever contributed to this.

Gals that catch and keep my eye....

1. Ana Massicot
2. Camille Yannantuono
3. Frances Nieves
4. Natalia Lopez Toledano
5. Vanda Gameiro

Guys.... *scratches heads* I have guys that I love to dance with, but I don't usually get a kick out of watching guys. So I can't really rank favorites on who comes across the best.....

[Shines]

Hmmmm.... not sure I've ever contributed to this.

Gals that catch and keep my eye....

1. Ana Massicot
2. Camille Yannantuono
3. Frances Nieves
4. Natalia Lopez Toledano
5. Vanda Gameiro

Guys.... *scratches heads* I have guys that I love to dance with, but I don't usually get a kick out of watching guys. So I can't really rank favorites on who comes across the best.....

hmm ... have not seen or heard of most of yours and could not find them on Youtube. My top 5 ladies would be

1> Ana Massicot
2> Jorget
3> Liz Lira
4> Naoko Clancy
5> Jennifer (Karisma)

[bolivicano]

hmmm this is a toughy. well heres my list

Salseros:
1. Oliver Pineda
2. Jayson Molina
3. Tito Ortos
4. Juan Matos
5. Al "Liquis Silver" Espinoza

Salseras:
1. Magna Gopal
2. Griselle Ponce
3. Edie TSF
4. Ana Massicot
5. Karel Flores

I would also like to edit this, :lol:

Salseros:
1. Oliver Pineda
2. Rasove Ramirez - Yamulee
3. Joel Dominguez
4. Shaka Brown
5. And it's between Mouaze Konate' & Adolfo Indacochea

Salseras:
1. Magna Gopal
2. Burju Hurturk Perez
3. Ahtoy Wonpat-Borja
4. Karel Flores
5. And it's also between Shani Talmor & Emily Alabi

[shaka]

Well, I'm flatered to have made some lists, and while I can't necessarily name 10 folks, I can harp on a couple things.
From a performance perspective, the people that I most enjoy watching perform would be.
Juan Matos
Gordon Neil
Mouaze Konate
Melissa Rosado
Griselle Ponce

From a teaching perspective, I put Eddie Torres as the number one and anyone else as a remote distant second. Eddies classes are magical, and being in one makes you feel like you are hanging out with Michaelangelo working on the Sistine Chapel.
"Now...let's put some representation of man being created in God's image right about here...oh yeah..."

From a social dance perspective, it's hard for me to give some guys names because I haven't social danced with a lot of guys, but I can remark on the women's reactions and my perception of how the dance looks like it feels, if that makes sense.
Milton Cobo is constantly in demand on the floor, and he has always been accomodating to dancers of different levels. Women are smiling and happy when they are dancing with him, without worrying about having missed a move or being outshined, which I think is important.
Beto Herrera - Same thing, women look like they are having fun dancing with him, he plays with the music, keeps the partnerwork interesting and works to make his partners feel comfortable.

[smiling28]

Well, I'm flatered to have made some lists, and while I can't necessarily name 10 folks, I can harp on a couple things.
From a performance perspective, the people that I most enjoy watching perform would be.
Juan Matos
Gordon Neil
Mouaze Konate
Melissa Rosado
Griselle Ponce

From a teaching perspective, I put Eddie Torres as the number one and anyone else as a remote distant second. Eddies classes are magical, and being in one makes you feel like you are hanging out with Michaelangelo working on the Sistine Chapel.
"Now...let's put some representation of man being created in God's image right about here...oh yeah..."

From a social dance perspective, it's hard for me to give some guys names because I haven't social danced with a lot of guys, but I can remark on the women's reactions and my perception of how the dance looks like it feels, if that makes sense.
Milton Cobo is constantly in demand on the floor, and he has always been accomodating to dancers of different levels. Women are smiling and happy when they are dancing with him, without worrying about having missed a move or being outshined, which I think is important.
Beto Herrera - Same thing, women look like they are having fun dancing with him, he plays with the music, keeps the partnerwork interesting and works to make his partners feel comfortable.

Great post and I agree completely especially about the aura/charisma of Eddie

[SalsaGipsy]

From a social dance perspective, it's hard for me to give some guys names because I haven't social danced with a lot of guys, but I can remark on the women's reactions and my perception of how the dance looks like it feels, if that makes sense.
Milton Cobo is constantly in demand on the floor, and he has always been accomodating to dancers of different levels. Women are smiling and happy when they are dancing with him, without worrying about having missed a move or being outshined, which I think is important.
Beto Herrera - Same thing, women look like they are having fun dancing with him, he plays with the music, keeps the partnerwork interesting and works to make his partners feel comfortable.

It would be great if you mention a few names of female dancers that you think are the top social dancers. :)

[shaka]

It would be great if you mention a few names of female dancers that you think are the top social dancers. :)

Hmm, that's harder, I don't think I can claim a favorite. Since each dance is different, I can have a phenomenal dance with someone and then the next time we cross paths things dont work out the same way. It's a blend of the song, the floor, the rum, and whatever other factors can jump out. While I haven't danced with her in years, I always enjoyed the dances I had with Jamie, who used to dance with Ismael Otero. She's vibe-responsive, and always willing to try out new things, which kept me from sinking into a rut when dancing with her. While in Egypt I had some great dances with some young ladies from Greece, I most remember Doria as being a sleeper. When I first danced with her I was impressed with how light a follow she was, and she was a lot of fun, I enjoyed repeat dances with her.
I generally try to make whoever I'm dancing with at the time my favorite partner.

[SalsaGipsy]

I generally try to make whoever I'm dancing with at the time my favorite partner.

... and somehow that's the right answer. ;) :D I'm sure all the ladies appreciate it.

[AguaDulce]

You're right about Doria. She is also an extremely nice person.

[jon321]

Magna :)

[SalsaGipsy]

Magna :)

I like your top 5 ;) :D

[AguaDulce]

hmm ... have not seen or heard of most of yours and could not find them on Youtube. My top 5 ladies would be

1> Ana Massicot
2> Jorget
3> Liz Lira
4> Naoko Clancy
5> Jennifer (Karisma)

I like your pics ... not a lot of groupie factor. I like Shaka's and Brownskin's pics as well.

[Shines]

I like your pics ... not a lot of groupie factor. I like Shaka's and Brownskin's pics as well.

Thanks but I have to revise this and replace Naoko Clancy with Anita from Spain who dances with Adrian.

[thepresenceon2]

I wholeheartedly second two of Brownski's picks...."Hmmmm.... not sure I've ever contributed to this.

Gals that catch and keep my eye....

1. Ana Massicot
2. Camille Yannantuono"

I have danced with both of them and they are amazing dancers. Quality and depth of movement are amazing. Camille and her partner at Positive Energy Michael John Saltus did an amazing Argentine Tango piece at the 2009 LA congress that was simply sensational. Not sure I know who the others are on her list are.

V

[AguaDulce]

Argentine Tango piece at the 2009 LA congress that was simply sensational.
V

How was the social dancing at the LA Congress for an On2 dancer?

[ptwist]

When I was at the congress.... i was compelled to put the two fingers question of "on1 or on2?"

Mixed bunch imo although the ones who did comfortable dance on2 were very good. Whereas those who just reluctantly agreed were not as smooth and at times slightly off timing.

Some dancers you just KNOW they are stronger on1 and thus you just dance with what they are strong at ...I just felt it out. SF/SD dancers were the hybrids ... where as the true LA dancers were predom. on1 you can tell by the flamboyant clothing :)

[AguaDulce]

When I was at the congress.... i was compelled to put the two fingers question of "on1 or on2?"

Mixed bunch imo although the ones who did comfortable dance on2 were very good. Whereas those who just reluctantly agreed were not as smooth and at times slightly off timing.

Some dancers you just KNOW they are stronger on1 and thus you just dance with what they are strong at ...I just felt it out. SF/SD dancers were the hybrids ... where as the true LA dancers were predom. on1 you can tell by the flamboyant clothing :)

Thanks ... sounds like it might be slim pickins so I'll probably skip this.

[thepresenceon2]

I had a great time social dancing at the LA congress. As a On2 person i thought there would be problems but a lot of people were at least conversant with On2 so it really wasnt a problem. In the absolute worst cases where people were a tad hesitant, I simply asked if they could follow and I said I could lead and we made it happen. Danced with Brownskin for the first time and that alone made the trip worth it. Surprisingly ran into a few NY heads as well who just randomly went for the congress. I danced till 3am every morning so it was def worth it for me and i'm definitely slighhty on the hardcore side with my social dancing. If it wasnt hot I would definitely let you know. Hope this helps.

V

[Brownskin818]

Thanks ... sounds like it might be slim pickins so I'll probably skip this.the range is about the same as what you got at palm springs, just a larger pool.

I had a great time social dancing at the LA congress. As a On2 person i thought there would be problems but a lot of people were at least conversant with On2 so it really wasnt a problem. In the absolute worst cases where people were a tad hesitant, I simply asked if they could follow and I said I could lead and we made it happen. Danced with Brownskin for the first time and that alone made the trip worth it. Surprisingly ran into a few NY heads as well who just randomly went for the congress. I danced till 3am every morning so it was def worth it for me and i'm definitely slighhty on the hardcore side with my social dancing. If it wasnt hot I would definitely let you know. Hope this helps.

V
http://www.ferienhaus-kobs.de/gb/images/flowers.gif

[Jag75]

Have you ever seen them dance?

I mean...

I tried to help demonstrate a cool turn pattern in Maria's class and she makes me shake in the knees. She has a huge stylish presence, it's quite intimidating. I'm a pretty confident guy with 5 years of "On 2" dancing under my belt and she made me feel like a beginner again, but I'm sure she didn't mean it.

As for Eddie Torres...

He lights up the room and NEVER forgets a face. He puts the SHINE in OPEN SHINE and the WORK in partner work. My wife and I religiously attended the Intermediate/Advance Sunday class for two years straight and he did not repeat a move. Each partner move was as unique as a human fingerprint. It was on the 106th class that he actually repeated part of a turn pattern that occured on the 30th class. *I kept a personal dance diary of all the moves he taught. Now it's a video library.

On a personal level I'm trying to crack the Eddie Torres code--similar to cracking the code in the matrix. <---Stupid analogy...but I'm sure you'll understand if you're a sci-fi fan. When ET approaches a class turn pattern he breaks the predictable approach and creates a facade of impossible leads and unorthodox movements. He doesn't let the music move him, he moves in the music with control and style.

His principal dancers, and these guys can JAM their asses off, still buckle at their feet because every movement he teaches breaks their usual "comfort move" coordination to salsa dancing.

He creates magical hand switches that baffle the best copycats. He creates turns patterns that will challenge the creative integrity of the best leaders and followers in the world.

In my opinion, it's very difficult for me to name anybody because they fail to come across to me with anything spectacular. Alot of the guys and couples I've seen dancing online look sooooooo smooth that it becomes overkill and then it becomes the equivalent of two people riding the Walt Disney Teacup amusement ride. With the exception of Alex DaSilva--he got some killer follower aerials, holds, pretzel turns, etc., and some of the couples dancing on the Mayan Competition Website--the leaders in some of those videos actually PERFORM with their follower. They are actually stepping with the beat and some of those performers don't "mush" their steps.

It's a shame that Eddie Torres didn't continue his On2 Online service. It was a plain website with killer moves for beginner thru advanced.

I've been learning some on2 shines that my instructor learned from ET whilst in NY and whoa - they're brilliant! They really entrench movement to the timing of the music, and use challenging foot positions relative to the count, both to the count, syncopated, and variations thereof.

I've heard of the legendary open shines that ET teaches, and how they seem infinite. I've seen the man dance and he has this something that *NO* other dancer I've seen has.

I'm gonna back you on ET being the best of the best, and I think you're right, no-one else really comes close.

[toscanis]

frankie martinez, oliver pineda, shaka brown, jhonny vasquez... and....and me ;p


from ladies - magna

By the way:
Hot Greetings from Poland to all brillant dancers
:)

[AguaDulce]

frankie martinez, oliver pineda, shaka brown, jhonny vasquez... and....and me ;p


from ladies - magna

By the way:
Hot Greetings from Poland to all brillant dancers
:)

You don't have much down for ladies??

[Salsamakossa]

So where is this video library you are talking about???? Got to admit that ET has unique turn patterns and handflicks and vivacity in the way he dances/teaches.

And when Shaka says everybody else is a distant second to ET, you gotta listen...lol.


Have you ever seen them dance?

I mean...

I tried to help demonstrate a cool turn pattern in Maria's class and she makes me shake in the knees. She has a huge stylish presence, it's quite intimidating. I'm a pretty confident guy with 5 years of "On 2" dancing under my belt and she made me feel like a beginner again, but I'm sure she didn't mean it.

As for Eddie Torres...

He lights up the room and NEVER forgets a face. He puts the SHINE in OPEN SHINE and the WORK in partner work. My wife and I religiously attended the Intermediate/Advance Sunday class for two years straight and he did not repeat a move. Each partner move was as unique as a human fingerprint. It was on the 106th class that he actually repeated part of a turn pattern that occured on the 30th class. *I kept a personal dance diary of all the moves he taught. Now it's a video library.

On a personal level I'm trying to crack the Eddie Torres code--similar to cracking the code in the matrix. <---Stupid analogy...but I'm sure you'll understand if you're a sci-fi fan. When ET approaches a class turn pattern he breaks the predictable approach and creates a facade of impossible leads and unorthodox movements. He doesn't let the music move him, he moves in the music with control and style.

His principal dancers, and these guys can JAM their asses off, still buckle at their feet because every movement he teaches breaks their usual "comfort move" coordination to salsa dancing.

He creates magical hand switches that baffle the best copycats. He creates turns patterns that will challenge the creative integrity of the best leaders and followers in the world.

In my opinion, it's very difficult for me to name anybody because they fail to come across to me with anything spectacular. Alot of the guys and couples I've seen dancing online look sooooooo smooth that it becomes overkill and then it becomes the equivalent of two people riding the Walt Disney Teacup amusement ride. With the exception of Alex DaSilva--he got some killer follower aerials, holds, pretzel turns, etc., and some of the couples dancing on the Mayan Competition Website--the leaders in some of those videos actually PERFORM with their follower. They are actually stepping with the beat and some of those performers don't "mush" their steps.

It's a shame that Eddie Torres didn't continue his On2 Online service. It was a plain website with killer moves for beginner thru advanced.

[Salsa Timing]

My favorites!
Salseros:
Oliver Pineda
Mikael Fonts
Luis Aguilar
Rodrigo Cortazar
Jose Aguilar

Salseras:
Liz Lira
Anya Katsevman
Griselle Ponce
Yanet Fuentes
Shani Talmor

[Blair]

Salsa Timing, you legend.

Luis Aguilar is a beast man, never even knew of him.

[Brownskin818]

Gals that catch and keep my eye....

1. Ana Massicot
2. Camille Yannantuono
3. Frances Nieves
4. Natalia Lopez Toledano
5. Vanda Gameiro

HAVE to add Serena Cuevas to this. Not sure who to bump though...
(OMG: youtube.com/watch?v=dXg49R9zpvQ)

[thepresenceon2]

adding Desiree Godsell. Dances with Griselle Ponce's Jerseys Finest and tours with r&B singer Santigold....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjeS2jJEatQ

[kbitten]

adding Desiree Godsell. Dances with Griselle Ponce's Jerseys Finest and tours with r&B singer Santigold....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjeS2jJEatQ

desirre is very nice !!! I remember you drolling over her on honey's kkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk

is she in this video too right?cause I remembered when she came to our carnival a friend of mine told me she used to dance in ET group.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EvtNU35uX_o&feature=related

[ColdSalsero]

adding Desiree Godsell. Dances with Griselle Ponce's Jerseys Finest and tours with r&B singer Santigold....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjeS2jJEatQ

<drool>...

[thepresenceon2]

Kbitten, yes i know she used to do stuff with ET. As a matter of fact on fri night of the BASF there was aroutine with ET and his dancers playing with the band where she performed as well. Absolutely fabulous dancing on her part and the rest of the ET dancers as well....

[Brownskin818]

desirre is very nice !!! I remember you drolling over her on honey's kkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk

is she in this video too right?cause I remembered when she came to our carnival a friend of mine told me she used to dance in ET group.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EvtNU35uX_o&feature=related
wow, her hips are so loose. wish mine could move like that.

[thepresenceon2]

Kbitten, yes thats her....LMAO at the drooling, but she is droolworthy...and such a phenomenal dancer its ridiculous......i wouldnt even limit her to being a salsera, she's just a dancer through and through, and it comes out in her salsa.........its interesting, there is a guy who dances for Tropical Image Dancers w Arelis Beato and he comes out of stuff so precise i find it amazing, well she comes out of stuff so friggin smoothly, its like flowing water, and i mean like spins, routines etc....she and Lori Perez have that ability to move out of and into stuff in this ridiculously effortless way thats so friggin hard to do but when seen just reinforces how sublime a skillset it is....

Brownskin, we already know you are your worst critic, b/c from this side of the fence, your hips move like magic as well.......

[petteri]

My favorites:

Salseros:
Eddie Torres (as teacher)
Milton Cobo
Oliver Pineda
Shaka Brown
Tito Ortos

Salseras:
All the wonderful ladies I have had pleasure to dance with :)

[volando]

1.Magna Gopal(creative)
2.Emily Alabi(awesome spins :O)
3.Vanda(great styling)
4.Karel Flores (has a nice flow in her dance)
5.Thalia (those muscles..lol)

Salseros

1.Of course Maykel Fonts
2.Frankie Martinez
3.Adolfo Indacochea
4.Marco Ferrigno
5.Johnny Vasquez

[tresto]

Hi

I'm pulling this thread up because I have just watched a few vids of burju.
*WARNING* I am not saying she is bad ! not at all ! read carefully

Many of you write she is "unique" and does this and that
I don't see it. What does she do that makes her special ? I watched a few vids and she just looks to me like any pro salsa dancer. I don't see flaws. But I don't see anything outstanding or different either. What am I missing ? I'm sure I'm missing something.

When I see a vid of Magna Gopal, Griselle Ponce, Vali Damaskou or Ana Masacote (just to name a few that come to mind) my immediate reaction is "wow!!!". Now maybe it's just that her style doesn't appeal to me, but I'm still interested in comments you might have.

[lurker]

dance with them then get back to us :)

offtopic: how long have you been dancing?

[kbitten]

burju is frankie martinez female version..her body movement and isolations are absurd...

[tresto]

OK, thanks kbitten.

I watched the videos again and now I see it.
Now I understand what people see in her.

What happened is that I was actually put off by the videos of Burju that I saw, but I though it was just that I didn't like the non-dancing part of her style (haircut, clothes, not my taste at all) so I just ignored that negative feeling and didn't write about it, since I didn't think it was relevant to the topic.
But really it's her body movement that stands out ; and since I dislike it (hey just personnal taste) this is where my negative feeling came from.

So lurker, here is my answer : it would probably be a bad experience for me to dance with her, because I would get distracted by her body movement that I don't like and it would prevent me from connecting properly / enjoy the dance.

Please note that I completely acknowledge that her body movement is unique, and must be very hard to do, and understand that some people may like it a lot. It's just not my type at all ; nothing more, nothing less.

[SalsaGipsy]

I was feeling a little bit like this at first as well but then I saw this video:

youtube.com/watch?v=SajlohYBZ-Q

Anybody who can choreograph and perform this is absolutely amazing - the uniqueness, the rawness and musicality of it blew me away.

Then I started looking for more videos and I found this among others:

youtube.com/watch?v=BacOstvY0fo

Again unique and musical but this time spontaneous and unchoreographed. I guess it would depend on the partner as well, if they inspire her in this way but to me she is now one of the top divas on the world scene.

[opm1s6]

burju is frankie martinez female version..her body movement and isolations are absurd...

Really? I thought that was Aisha or Lori....

[acpjr]

Damn, didn't expect the Burju hate. Remember guys, she's the chick in the video being tossed around by those Italians for 10 minutes at a congress somewhere to a remix of that super fast Richie Ray & Bobby Cruz song. She definitely has the following skills, and it's no question to me that she is the star of Hacha Y Machete.

Is the hate due to her not having typical "feminine" style?

[lurker]

When it comes to follows, these days, I keep judgement to myself if any. i've learned that one should have a dance with whatever lady is in question before dismissing her.

This reminds me of that Russian lady thepresenceon2 was raving about not too long ago. Someone found a video of her and posted it. Most proceeded to say she was nothing special while the two or three who had danced with her raved about her movement and musicality. I too saw the video and thought she looked ordinary. But I knew better. I had danced with her about 6 times during that big apple festival time when she visited. She was as good as brownskin and thepresence described. I thought about backing their claim but realized it wouldn't make any difference. People believe their eyes more than second-hand experiences; and who can blame them. It's human nature I suppose. But more than that, these dance experiences are subjective. My enjoyment with a follow does not guarantee others' enjoyment. Although, at the technical level, one should be objective. So a dance should at the very least give you an idea. Unless one is a bad lead in denial or unaware of it.

The truth is that follows are usually at the mercy of the lead, unless she is a magna-like follow who is willing to hijack the lead at times or take advantage of every little opening. But even Magna has admitted that she only risks it with guys who have a good frame and she trusts, otherwise she might get hurt, or hurt someone else. Point is, you won't necessarily see a follow's full potential by checking out a random video. Even a lead's potential, but to a much lesser extend. This is why I advised Tresto to dance with her then get back to us.

I have not danced with Burju so I am not really saying tresto will or will not like her. That's not the point at all. Point is that videos can be misleading for many reasons and can also be right on target at times, which is why advise to go for the dance to make sure. I say this in the general sense of course. It's not like they live next door :)

When it comes to Shani I can provide some personal and anectodal analysis since someone mentioned her. Personally, I'm not crazy about her styling/style, but man, she is a heck of a follow. I don't do the craziest patterns but I do know some who do and they rave about her. What I said about Shani is true for Melissa Rosado. Do not like her styling/style but also an amazing follow. Never danced or asked about Griselle though.

The opposite is true. I know of some popular or well regarded follows who look great and put on a show on video but are ordinary follows at best so I'm left wondering about their popularity. No need to give their names. That's not my style. After all, this thread is about top favorite salsera(o), not about unfavorite ones.

[thepresenceon2]

Lurker, I'm consistently impressed with your ability to make well thought out posts that really flesh out issues in a way thats logical and insightful. With Burju, great follow, she hits her styling all th time in a way that not intrusive to a leader at all. Her shines are also fabulous particularly in that she has her own style, her style never feels derivative....Along those lines, i've seen her rock with super complex turn patterns to not so complex and never misses a beat.......yes i'v personally dancer with her on numerous occasions....

[opm1s6]

He's been trained well :P

[kbitten]

Really? I thought that was Aisha or Lori....

I didnt mean she look like him..

I meant they have body isolations that are very hard to pursue...

the only frankies "girls" I saw "live" was keren..and I dont like a thing about her..she seems light as a feather though

[tresto]

Damn, didn't expect the Burju hate. Remember guys, she's the chick in the video being tossed around by those Italians for 10 minutes at a congress somewhere to a remix of that super fast Richie Ray & Bobby Cruz song. She definitely has the following skills, and it's no question to me that she is the star of Hacha Y Machete.

Is the hate due to her not having typical "feminine" style?

Dude there is no hate.
Maybe it came across like that, if so I'm sorry and I'd like to say very directly that no there is no hate at all on my part. It's just "I don't like her styling", no more, no less. And I have to admit I have a very strong prejudice against "overstyling" because in my experience it always comes with a negative side : interference with lead/follow.
This includes some world renowned dancers I have tried to dance with and gave me a bad experience. I have also on other occasions danced with women who from the outside looked very plain, that I randomly invited to dance, and turned out fantastic. You can't really know in advance except for very obvious things (such messed up timing or bad balance), thanks lurker for reminding us all of this fact.

So lets go back to Burju. If she can do her thing without messing up the lead/follow, why not. It might be her real talent and she may be super fun to dance with. I don't know for sure and this is why I used the word "probably".

I'll tell you how it goes the day I dance with her !

[wildbill20056]

I think you have to be careful when critiquing a follow based on whether her particular styling would interfere with your particular leading.

Again it's totally subjective as to what is and isn't over styling. I'm guessing from how you describe your preferences, Tresto, that you would hate a partner than Hijacks you at all.

Follows don't exist simply to be the most easily led woman/guy on the dance floor. A great leader adapts to the follow too, realises when she wants/needs space and doesn't crowd her by over-leading. I don't particularly desire someone totally quiescent who simply does as told as per the text book.

[tresto]

Hey wildbill
Thanks for your concern.
To me there is a very big difference in missing a move because of styling that gets in the way (which equates lack of skill or disconnect), and purposely refusing a lead just to play.

A follow can break the physical connection to do her thing and still keep the connection with the leader with eye contact, a smile, or body language (ie. extends her hand back right after to communicate "thanks, I'm done go ahead lead again"). This is completely OK and if done well it's fun ! French women are very playful, they do that stuff all the time. Today I actually had one lead herself in another move purposely, then stick her tongue out to me... We had a good laugh !

Tanja Kensinger gives a pretty good explanation and says that she has done some herself and it messed up quite a bit.
http://islandtouchdance.com/blog/?p=59
This is, after all, a PARTNER dance. If you feel that your partner does not make you “look good” so now you must, in order to express yourself, style even bigger or dance on your own, then may I suggest taking up Jazz or Hip Hop where partnering is not involved. =)

So sure, it's cool that the follower does more than "just following", but it must be done in a controlled way.

I would also like to add that I have danced with a couple ladies who had incredible styling that completely wowed me yet didn't interfere with the lead, and that yes sometimes they played a bit, but all of it was done on purpose. I also have much more experience with follows who try some over styling and mess the lead because it is done badly. This is what annoys me. So I guess I just have some prejudice against too much styling because except in very rare cases, it gets in the way of partnerwork.

I hope my communication is more clear now !

Cheers

[kbitten]

TRESTO -

Burju was here in Brasil last weekend and I asked ALL guys I know who danced with her if her styling interfered with their lead and the answers were : "no, she is wonderful, she is the best follower, she makes me play with the song,etc"

she doesnt have the "ladies style "most girls do and thats why she is awsome and unique..

I danced with victor a couple of times and he made me play with the song and do things with my body I didnt do with other leads..his energy is amazing and you feel like youre dancing with a long time friend and not a international teacher..

I love that they dont have the diva attitude..I wish there were more couples like them

[thepresenceon2]

Kbitten, yeah Burju is always the essence of cool and low key.....