No Me Acostumbro

[peachexploration]

I'm going to guess that at least 85% of follows have a difficult time adjusting to partner in the beginning. Most times, if we are not "accustomed" to dancing "with" someone as in real partner dancing. We (myself included) struggle big time when it comes to allowing a leader to orchestrate so to speak, the DANCE. What are some of the remedies and/or techniques you use as follows to eliminate the back leading/anticipation bug?

[vin]

I am not a good follow yet but I think leads can help here. As a lead we should be prepared to throw similar sequences at our follows while having variations so as to prevent your follow from anticipating.

An example, sometimes I cross body lead, sometimes I throw a little spin led from the shoulder on to it. Sometimes I stop my partner mid spin and spin her the other way with a free spin. Sometimes I stop my partner mid spin and lead her behind me.

As a lead if we throw variations at our follows then they can't anticipate what we are going to give them and this keeps them from backleading.

[peachexploration]

I am not a good follow yet but I think leads can help here. As a lead we should be prepared to throw similar sequences at our follows while having variations so as to prevent your follow from anticipating.. Right Vin. This happens quite often particulary in Casino Rueda. One of the problems for us with this style is already knowing the move and once we're outside the group and dancing one on one, the anticipation creeps in and makes it difficult for the lead.

And yes, I totally agree that leads should throw in lots of variations. Even in class. Well, that would depend on your instructor but I do think it's a good idea for both sides that once you're given a "pattern" so to speak in class, make it as "unpatterned" as you can to prevent us follows from backleading and anticipating. Anyone else?

[peachexploration]

Any other follow with tips on this issue? :)

[lucretia]

I usually work to establish eye contact. This mostly helps. Even with the worst leaders OR the days I feel bad and know that I dance like :twisted: or :cry:

Whenever eye contact is established I know whats coming next. Some kind of subconsious language. But some leaders keep the door closed and then there is nothing to do.

/Luc

[salsachinita]

I think a mode change is the key to not anticipat/back lead.

Switching your focus from being analytical (left brianed) to simply being in a state of blank (which I'm assuming to be right brained :? )

The following was an old post of mine:

As a female follower, I know no lead; nor is it my role to lead. The more I dance with different people (no matter what style/timing/level) the more I learn. I submit myself as a 'blank' in the presence of a lead. I am water, I will assume the shapes of vessels that contains me.

I realized that the more I learn, the less I 'know' , and the more 'empty' or 'blank' I've become. This is making me a better follower, a little bit everyday.

For the whole discussion see http://www.dance-forums.com/viewtopic.php?t=2006&postdays=0&postorder=asc. My post is on page four.

[peachexploration]

What about role reversal in order to minimize anticipation?

[hopelessly_addicted]

What about role reversal in order to minimize anticipation?

hrm.. do you mean that if say followers learn to lead, they'd understand better how hard it is to lead and thus be more sensitive to backleading? :roll: I'm not sure if I understand your question...

Supposedly, having the right weight distribution and committing weight on every each steps you step helps responding to leads quicker (although I haven't mastered the weight distribution so I'm still to find out but this makes sense to me).

If you are quick at responding to leads, then not changing directions till you receive leads would help in minimising anticipation. As I said earlier, because I'm still not perfectly balanced on each step, I feel sometimes I lag in responding because I wait till the very last minute that the leads signal... :x

[peachexploration]

What about role reversal in order to minimize anticipation?

hrm.. do you mean that if say followers learn to lead, they'd understand better how hard it is to lead and thus be more sensitive to backleading? :roll: I'm not sure if I understand your question...

Yup, that's exactly what I mean. :)

[squirrel]

I'd say learning the other role would definitely improve one's dancing...

[Guarachero]

PeachXploration:

As you mention the problem of knowing the moves in Rueda, how would you cope with a Rueda wherein moves are unrehersed? In other words, a Rueda imprivised right at a club with people who you don't even know?

Guarachero

[peachexploration]

Peachexploration:

As you mention the problem of knowing the moves in Rueda, how would you cope with a Rueda wherein moves are unrehersed? In other words, a Rueda imprivised right at a club with people who you don't even know?

Guarachero
Rueda...unrehearsed? Hmmm....Well the thing about Rueda where I live is that unless the Leads are awesome at Leading, everyone still has to know the moves. It is actually very rare to find a lead who can actually Lead in Rueda unless they are quite advanced or instructors. So for those who don't know the basics of Salsa in general, it will be hard improvise. A lot of schools use Rueda moves as a way to teach Salsa which I think is not a very good idea. It's fun but unless you have an awesome instructor who teaches the importance leading and following skills, you will have problems down the line. I've seen it many times.

[Guarachero]

Right PeachXploration. Knowing the moves is key.

I've seen some disastrous Ruedas that way. And improvised Ruedas that I’ve been in, were among top dancers. But that I have not seen in Kansas City, where there are no advanced dancers, not even the instructors :cowboy: (although they don’t know it) who charge people to teach. (I’ve never seen so many stiff dancers in my live!!!).

Improvised Ruedas can still be seen in Tropicana and El Turquino in Havana. Other than that, the only thing I’ve been able to do here is to partner swap, which is done in Havana among friends, but here they call it Rueda---Ha!

[salsachinita]

Hmmm.....

The kind of Rueda I know & love is NEVER reheased :? ........

Sure, people (leads especially) DO have to know the moves (names and all) quite well, and it helps if the followers are decent at following. Even better, if all the leads 'click' (the kind of brotherly boys thing....you know what I mean).

Some of the best rueda I've taken parts in are the fresh, impromptu ones at clubs, in smaller groups. Sometimes most of us were strangers.

Having said that, I DO agree with PeachE that Rueda moves as class materials alone are not ideal, unless extensive leading/following skills are taught. I'm yet to see a school that includes really good lead/follow skills as part of their regular materials (sure, you can get workshops, but IMHO better results can be achieved by regular instalments).

Most of us developed what we know at the clubs (over time), not in classes.......

[peachexploration]

....The kind of Rueda I know & love is NEVER reheased :? .............By unrehearsed, I mean that someone who only knows LA or NY will have a difficult time participating in an impromptu Rueda at a club being as though they would need to know the basics of the calls, partner changes, the mechanics of leading and following as it relates to Rueda, not to mention that sometimes the moves are regional, etc.

[Guarachero]

[quote="mean that someone who only knows LA or NY will have a difficult time......not to mention that sometimes the moves are regional, etc.

Thanks PeachXploration.

I’ve never thought of area. ¡How could I have missed that! :doh:

In Havana is easy because of the size of the city, whereas in the US, each region developed its own style.

But, you know? That same regional thing was what made Rueda move from Patricio Lumumba to the rest of Havana? What we are probably seeing is the propagation of Rueda dressed with local customs. You're right :idea:

[squirrel]

The basics have to be known, IMO... but the moves no! I mean, leaders are supposed to LEAD it, no?

[Guarachero]

Yes. That's understood. To me, the basics are those things we all do: Casino.

[Rosa]

....The kind of Rueda I know & love is NEVER reheased :? .............By unrehearsed, I mean that someone who only knows LA or NY will have a difficult time participated in a impromptu Rueda at club being as though they would need to know the basics of the calls, partner changes, the mechanics of leading and following as it relates to Rueda, not to mention that sometimes the moves are regional, etc.

I agree. I've tried Rueda class and I like it, but being an LA/NY style of dancer I found I had to start at the beginning again with Rueda. OK, in certain ways it was easy to adapt, but even so, it's a very different style of Salsa.

Rosa :)

[Guarachero]

OK, Rosa, if you adapted, it means it was not that hard. When it comes to Rueda, it's different than partner dance. The Ruedas some people make here in Kansas City are so bad and they look so ridiculuous, that none of us five Cubans want to dance with them. We make our own. So I would never adapt to their slappy thing. :headwall: